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Author: Dr. Nikolaus Klepp
To: dng
Subject: Re: [DNG] [devuan-dev] Of confidence and support and the future of Devuan.
Anno domini 2019 Tue, 23 Apr 12:32:29 +0900
mett scripsit:
> On 2019年4月23日 11:24:39 JST, Rick Moen <rick@???> wrote:
> >Dan, it is _not_ time for you to leave. Please stay.
> >
> >I've seen only the public portions of these text-format interactions,
> >but think I'm seen enough data to assess the basic situation. Although
> >I'm a friendly outsider to Devuan Project governance, I've seen many
> >similar destructive spirals in open source projects over many decades:
> >It starts with well-intended individual actions taken without adequate
> >consultation, which cause reactions from other parties who feel taken
> >by
> >surprise. When those reactions are in e-mail, or (slightly worse) in
> >e-mail with a large audience such as on mailing lists, then a
> >communication anti-pattern tends to take hold that drives the parties
> >into confrontation, frustration, and perception of harm that could have
> >been resolved if the parties had switched to more-interactive,
> >more-personal, and less public means of communication -- such as voice
> >telephone or Internet video conferencing.
> >
> >As to Denis/Jaromil's comments about the ci.devuan.org failure, yes, he
> >spoke sharply to you about some of your initial steps, but, if you
> >review what he said, the main points were that (1) better consultation
> >should have occurred throughout and (2) he asked you to wait before
> >taking additional action. IMO, if you set aside for a moment the tinge
> >of personal accusation you're perceiving in what he wrote, you will see
> >that those are reasonable comments from a project-management
> >perspective.
> >
> >Back when I was manager of a department of system administrators, I
> >told my employees that I'd shield them from problems visited onto our
> >department from other parts of the firm and help their professional
> >development, and in return I asked and expected two things: (1)
> >Do their assigned share of our work, but equally important, (2) make
> >sure I was never blindsided about anything they did, i.e., if there
> >was bad news in which they were involved, I expected to hear it from
> >them first and immediately, not later or from anyone else.
> >
> >Devuan Project of course differs in being less-hierarchical not to
> >mention volunteer, but good and timely communication is every bit as
> >important if not more so, and the antipatterns I've seen lately appear
> >to _all_ involve failure to do timely consultation, and then reliance
> >on
> >known-problematic _asynchronous_ communication methods such as e-mail /
> >mailing lists that are inadequate to the situation and tend to worsen
> >interpersonal conflict, avoidably.
> >
> >Devuan has suffered enough loss, and I wish everyone would please
> >de-escalate and to understand that e-mail is not the right solution for
> >all communication needs, especially where there is risk of
> >contentiousness and hard feelings.
> >
> >And you belong here, and would be greatly missed.
> >
> >
> >-- 
> >Cheers,                          "I am not a vegetarian because I love
> >animals; 
> >Rick Moen                        I am a vegetarian because I hate
> >plants."
> >rick@???                                    -- A. Whitney
> >Brown
> >McQ! (4x80)        
> >_______________________________________________
> >Dng mailing list
> >Dng@???
> >https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

> Hi,
> I second what Rick Moen said.
> Centurion_Dan, please stay.
> And guys, relax please.
> If you don t, the situation won t
> defuse.
> Yoroshiku!

+1 from me. There's always a point of crysis in any project, sooner or later. Pressure builds up, involvement gets personal. Take a deep breath, look at what you have acomplished, be proud of it. Face the fact that humans are complicated beeings, and you are one of them. Get some booze, yell at each other, have a good fight ... and probably have a good read, I suggest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterix_and_the_Great_Divide


Please do not email me anything that you are not comfortable also sharing with the NSA, CIA ...