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Author: Jaromil
To: dng
Subject: Re: [DNG] logging uses of machine-id
On Thu, 14 Mar 2019, golinux@??? wrote:

> On 2019-03-14 03:48, Rick Moen wrote:
> > Quoting KatolaZ (katolaz@???):
> >
> > > I just wonder whether your nice solution is enough for a wider
> > > audience used to have things popping up around all the time. I guess
> > > it's not, as much as setnet is not a solution to manage networks
> > > palatable to a wider audience, as much as apt-get is not the tool used
> > > by the large majority of users to install packages, and so on.
> > >
> > > Tinkerers will always be fine. But a distro that aims to be universal
> > > like Devuan must also cater for those who are not willing to tinker
> > > around, IMHO.
> >
> > I'm quoting the above in order to express appreciation for it -- in
> > context. Like Steve Litt, I favour the smallest possible entanglement
> > with Freedesktop.org 'desktop' components and their characteristic
> > tangled dependency trees and difficult-to-justify complications,
> > -=but=- the key fact is that Devuan Project has committed to be a
> > universal operating system, construed as including DE-style software
> > integration.
> >
> > I would not have supported that commitment, personally, but nonetheless
> > can summon the wisdom to avoid expecting this project to abandon its
> > principles just because I don't share some of them. And I thank you for
> > aptly restating those principles.
> >
> >
> When I first started using Debian, there was discussion of what
> "universal" meant. Vocal old timers insisted it referred to the
> variety of architectures that Debian would run on not different user
> preferences. I am not arguing here; just providing some context of
> the definition that has stuck in my mind (which may or may not be
> "correct").

I prefer to avoid the term "universal", whose adoption hints on a
limited and perhaps authoritarian attitude, at least referring to the
meaning of the term in philosophy. Also it makes me wonder what people
think of, when they go around making a "universal system" with a
"apt-get install anarchy" t-shirt... really?!.

IMHO Devuan should aim to be a *base system* (and Debian too!). Being
a "base" entails being minimal ("need to work" principle) and reliable
for other derivatives, not a moving target, not an opinionated
advanced system. Along this line, we are good with providing simple
formulas for desktop/embedded/vm system that provide bases for
derivatives, as well an efficient (and soon well documented) SDK for
making them.