Unadulterated freedom for self is absolute danger to others. Instead of
trying to teach freedom (which comes naturally in life), try teaching
responsibility, something libertarians, anarchists, and bitcoiners all seem
to lack ("Oh I broke that? Not my problem, let the free market fix it." "Oh
my released code contained the password that enabled people to steal money
that wasn't theirs? Whatever, they're rich and can afford it" "Oh my system
people trusted in failed and everyone lost their money? Whatever,
anarchy!!!11").

Hate to bring a fictional comic character into this (although it's fitting
since everyone here is pretty much a nerd) but with great freedom comes
great power, and with great power comes great responsibility. A major
problem I've noticed isn't a lack of freedom (just because your government
writes a law against you doesn't mean *you're* not free, you can leave.
Unless you're North Korean. I'm American and haven't touched America in 10
years), it's a lack of adequate responsibility, like how it's okay to
report that you "found Satoshi", or to spy on people because "NSA".
Responsibility. Freedom is for flies, freedom to annoy and ransack, to
attack and run away without repercussions.

Back to the blind money reference, even if you get all the freedom in the
universe, if you wasted your life being nonconstructive and not helping
mankind in any shape or form, you're a true blind monkey. If all you did
was post in an email list and wait for extremists to write code for you,
you're the blind monkey. Anyway, it's not healthy to be obsessed with
freedom because it tends to make you unnecessarily paranoid and forget the
freedoms that are right in front of you. Anyone who hasn't watched
Idiocracy, please do-- that's what will happen with "total freedom",
freedom to waste people's time, freedom to spread ignorance, etc.

Don't get me wrong, I like the way some anarchists and libertards here talk
because it reminds me that we can in fact move *past* the ideas of the men
alive today and build for tomorrow *despite* them. I agree with that and
will be dedicating my life to mankind (not the one alive right now) being
bettered by something I do, even if ever so slightly. I'm not interested in
waging wars against a living government now anymore than I am interested in
going back in time and freeing the slaves a week sooner. Let idiots fight
idiots. Mankind has to deal with its own plights, we are artists who cannot
be brought down by emotional bullshit. Yes, there are liars in the senate
and they are actively trying to take more power in a make believe system.
Ohnoes!1 There's also a gun store next to your house. Do something about
it, pussy. We are technologists who need to focus on the future. I agree to
give up on the peace corp rhetoric and just build so that the new systems
will adopt (or not, who cares, let them burn in 50 years). When someone
comes asking why it was built, you can merely respond "because it seems to
make better sense". You don't need to try and sell them volume 6 of the
obscure cryptoanarchist journal e-book, nor does everyone in the world need
bitcoin in order to function freely. You can function in a communist regime
that uses fiat currency and has slavery. You can also function in North
Korea, writing a bitcoin client for dear leader. No one is stopping you
from building or being useful, and everything that is made is eventually
recognized. I argue that any "urgency" is due to selfish interests. The
world isn't any "worse" or "better" than it ever was, and as always, when
things get too difficult to handle, there is an uprising, things reset.
Maybe you should be working on your marksmanship as much as your code.

</end rant>

I'm gonna go hug a tree now.



On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Caleb James DeLisle <cjd@???> wrote:

> Thanks Amir and thanks Thomas and Nicolás and thanks to the people who
> said I'm wrong for being so gloomy. I don't know exactly where I want
> to go next but I'm feeling that we need to build tools which don't just
> give freedom but really *teach* freedom. Freedom is not something that
> can be trained, we need to learn how to build tools which encourage
> people to understand the systems around them, whatever they may be, to
> question the constraints which have been placed by physics and by other
> people and teach them to care.
>
> More on this after I have a chance to think it over. Probably an update
> to thewebmustdie.com
>
> Bitcoin and cjdns are "here's your freedom" tools, they are good but we
> can do better.
>
> Thanks,
> Caleb
>
>
> On 03/24/2014 06:40 PM, Amir Taaki wrote:
> > hey caleb, I like cjdns as a project and whatever happens I think it is
> > very cool and innovative.
> > You might also want to look into the ZeroMQ community. Pieter Hintjens
> > is a genius and it's a great project.
> >
> > The thing to remember about what we do, is that it's just not making
> > replacements or alternatives. It's about making tools for people.
> >
> > Why would people use your tools? Because they are better for them.
> >
> > We have to start thinking of the advantages or new things that our tools
> > bring to the table. We aren't making them for money, but for something
> > bigger and more fulfilling, more useful to our lives.
> >
> > We need to look to ourselves, see what we do better and play on our
> > strengths. And we need to stop making copycat "alternative"
> > replacements. Think what you can do better, more open and make tools
> > that *really* serve the people.
> >
> > In fact as developers for DarkWallet, we have more freedom to explore
> > concepts that other developers would stay away from.
> > We are not worried about taking investment (since our costs are low) so
> > we don't need to compromise on our vision. We are transparent about our
> > motive, and we don't need to play to any crowd for acceptance. Our
> > imagination is the limit. We are in the same boat with a bond stronger
> > than $$$, but fueled by imagination of what's possible in our world.
> >
> > And we are not shying away from the software being political. We openly
> > promote our values because we believe they're good values. And our users
> > hence know that the software is serving them.
> >
> > You know when BitcoinQt has implemented payments protocol which doesn't
> > help p2p transfers, small businesses or the black market, but helps
> > Bitcoin corporations like BitPay. Who is that software serving?
> >
> > On 24/03/14 16:55, Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
> >> I'm sorry if I've disturbed you. If this list is strictly about
> technology
> >> then it is probably not a place for me.
> >> I have some additional thoughts in response to comments here and on
> >> socialswarm-discuss which I wanted to share.
> >>
> >> There is a parallel thread on socialswarm-discussion@??? so
> if
> >> this thread is offensive then we can move.
> >>
> >> ----
> >>
> >> A few thoughts:
> >>
> >> I just threw 3 years of my life into cjdns and I'm now coming to the
> >> conclusion that it's not solving the real problem. Forgive me, I'm not
> in
> >> my best form.
> >>
> >> Wikipedia is proof that an alternative can not only exist but can garner
> >> the #1 space on every google search, all is not lost.
> >>
> >> I value art, music, and literature and some will be far better than I
> can
> >> ever hope to be at all of these but long ago society decided that
> nomatter
> >> what a great musician or artist you may be, you will be compelled to
> attend
> >> school and learn to read because the threat to democracy of an
> illiterate
> >> populous was too grave to accept. In this world with a computer on every
> >> desk and in every pocket, everybody has an obligation to have a certain
> >> level of understanding of these things.
> >>
> >> I must remember that as a child, I didn't want to learn how to read
> either
> >> and I distinctly recall telling my parents I would simply invent a
> machine
> >> to make people not need to know how to read. Forgiveness is deserved.
> >>
> >> All of the concentration on usability is, as we would say in the US,
> >> barking up the wrong tree. We will never be able to make open source
> >> projects more "usable" than facebook and their army of designers, we
> >> can only hope to flatten the field with eduction.
> >>
> >> The 19th and 20th century compulsory education model will never succeed
> >> here, every university CS class I've attended was teaching 5-10 year old
> >> CS *history*.
> >>
> >>
> >> tl;dr give a man a fish, feed him for a day, teach him how to fish and
> >> he'll be fed for a lifetime, or maybe he'll just sit in a boat and drink
> >> beer :)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 03/24/2014 02:23 PM, Jacob wrote:
> >>> I seriously dont know what this ranting f this has to do with
> bitcoin...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 2:03 PM, Manfred Karrer <mk@???> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> "Today our world runs on silicon and bits, the written language of
> the day
> >>>> is code and in this sea of information, anyone who remains illiterate
> does
> >>>> so by choice. "
> >>>>
> >>>> Remembers me on Vilém Flussers Medienkultur, one of the philosophical
> >>>> grandfathers of the internet.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Am 24.03.2014 um 11:04 schrieb Caleb James DeLisle <cjd@???>:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I felt that I had to express something so I wrote it and gave it a
> >>>> domain.
> >>>>> http://thewebmustdie.com/
> >>>>>
> >>>>> tl;dr cjd is being a princess again, it happens.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Caleb
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
> >>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
> >>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
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> >>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
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> >>
> >
> >
> >
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