On Mon, 4 Mar 2024 07:15:09 -0600, o1bigtenor wrote in message
<CAPpdf5-x6Py-Q98=jnwno-j1Kw9kW1eWHT8KshJ1py+ujNywUQ@???>:

> On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 6:24 AM wirelessduck--- via Dng
> <dng@???> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On 3 Mar 2024, at 06:45, o1bigtenor via Dng <dng@???>
> > wrote:
> >
> > TL;DR
> > (I installed snapd on my system because I really really wanted to
> > work with virtual systems
> > and LXD seemed like a great solution. LXD still seems to be a
> > pretty good solution but to
> > run it you MUST be using snapd and that's a subsystem that forces
> > you to do a LOT of
> > things the way 'canonical' wants you to - - - you have absolutely NO
> > choice in any part of it
> > after you start. And - - - - removing snapd - - - well - - for me
> > it was a what I call a M$ fix
> > - - - I had to re-install! (Absolutely could not cleanly remove
> > snapd no matter how many
> > rm -r I tried!.))
> >
> >
> > Every time I’ve had to remove snap from an Ubuntu installation it
> > needs to remove the installed snaps before you can uninstall the
> > snap daemon.
> >
> > https://www.baeldung.com/linux/snap-remove-disable
> >
> >
> > I can lo longer remember the exact order I removed things in.
> My key point was - - - - someone else forced updates and upgrades on
> their schedule.
> Using options offered by the support team the result was that my
> server would shut down.
> Rather than not upgrading the system was forced down.
> There were NO options for otherwise.
> I tried to follow a clear out (method of removal) offered by the then
> lead tech (Stephane iirc the name).
> Still wasn't possible.
> The resultant mess taught me that trusting something that a big
> company puts out when
> its desperately trying to get a market valuation increased and
> legitimate is a terrible idea
> and should not be done. Also taught me that ubuntu is not truly open
> source
> - - - even if
> it purports to be.
> So maybe I'm too paranoid about my security and privacy - - -
> possible. Except its my
> choice to try things and when they bite and hard - - - I feel quite
> honor bound in letting
> the rest of the world know that that cute benign looking froggy
> actually is looking to
> swallow (own) me and likely you as well.
>
> Regards


..is Debian still going to keep apt "in control of everything"?
I ask because Debian is our upstream and decides waaay too much
of what we should decide here on Devuan policy, and because the
output of how-can-i-help (and how-can-i-help --old ) is getting
_long_, as in well over an hundred lines in my 2 Devuan laptops.

..adding -a (or --all) tells us the distro-wide story:
arnt@d45:~$ how-can-i-help --old --all |wc -l
8740
arnt@d45:~$ how-can-i-help --old --all |grep removal |wc -l
2082

..note that my clever wee grep didn't catch the "Packages [THAT
_HAS_ BEEN] removed from Debian" listed between the "Packages
removedfrom Debian 'testing' (the maintainer might need help)
: " line and the "Packages going to be removed from Debian
'testing' (the maintainer might need help): " line.

..these cut-n-pasted into how-can-i-help--old-a, then ...
arnt@dvn:~$ wc -l how-can-i-help--old-a
4224 how-can-i-help--old-a

...tells me we have lost well over 4 thousand packages and
may lose another 2 thousand packages in the near future.

..which along with usrmerge etc põtterisms has me question the
wisdom in keeping Debian as the only Devuan upstream.
Me, I'd add Slackware, we can stll build tools like alien and
fakeroot from source.

--
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
Scenarios always come in sets of three:
best case, worst case, and just in case.