On Sat, Jul 22, 2017 at 03:51:54PM -0700, Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting KatolaZ (katolaz@???):
>
> > Strange as it may sound to you, yes, there are still many users who
> > are using i386 hw, and the only reasonable way for them to continue
> > use those hw is by having Linux.
>
> While I'm sure this is true for some number of people, aren't these now
> incredibly old computers? (I say this as someone still running his
> flagship Internet server on an antique PIII, by the way.)
>
> [Long list of makers] everyone moved to a x86_64 flavour around
> 2003-ish (or exited the market). So, I estimate that these computers
> are at least 14 years old.

> I mean, I did install Debian m68k on an antique (circa 1990) Apple
> Macintosh IIci -- 25 MHz Motorola 68030 CPU, 4MB standard RAM expandable
> using up to 16 x 4 MB 80ns 30-pin SIMMs, SCSI 40MB hard disk -- and
> you can still do that in 2017, but... really. Friends asked me how it
> ran Debian, and I replied 'Well, it walked Debian briskly.'

Both are in the hobbyist-only niche. Preserving old gear for future
generations is a noble goal, but running newest eye-candy on hardware that
old is not an effective use of a distribution's limited resources.

> > All those users are being left without any other choice than throwing
> > their hw away by many distributions, without a concrete motivation
> > (well, except the usual "it's old so it must be thrown away", which is
> > as popular as lame these days...)

If you want a motivation, measure the juice taken by that i386 box. One I
have (well, amd64 but from that era) takes 222W under light load or 185W when
totally idle. Its replacement takes 15W with two disks attached. One
Watt-year is around $1, depending on country ($1.25 in Poland, $3.2 in
Germany).

Another box from that era, this time 32-bit only, with an "energy efficient"
model of Pentium 4, takes 110W idle, 170W under moderate load.

I guess those Atoms take a lot less than that, but are also far less
capable. Any of these can't hold a candle even to a modern ARM SoC.

Thus, it's not that financially-limited people can't afford to upgrade.
They can't afford to _not_ upgrade. They won't want an ARM, but an used x86
can be had for peanuts or literally free. Plenty of acceptable machines
get thrown away.


Meow!
--
⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ A dumb species has no way to open a tuna can.
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ A smart species invents a can opener.
⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ A master species delegates.