Santi narrated, I wrote & edited.

On 01/11/13 19:39, Tristan Winters wrote:
> Who wrote that part??? It?s fucking shit hot. The part about the
> founding fathers, federation of states and local decision making
> made me fist pump the air.
>
>
> On 1 Nov 2013, at 6:17 pm, Amir Taaki <genjix@???
> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>> wrote:
>
> did you read the section of the darkwallet.unsystem.net
> <http://darkwallet.unsystem.net> called we dont have to cooperate
> with control freaks?
>
> On 01/11/13 18:15, Jason King wrote:
>>>> I don't think anyone is advocating explaining ourselves to
>>>> the legacy power structure. And I also understand that IS
>>>> what the Bitcoin Foundation is currently engaged in. My point
>>>> is that is ultimately only detrimental to the bitcoin
>>>> foundation. It is irrelevant to anything being done here. In
>>>> fact, you can probably make the argument that the futility
>>>> they participate in by engageing regulators is actually
>>>> keeping the spotlight off all the other work being done.
>>>>
>>>> It doesn't have to be us vs them. It is my opinion that
>>>> engaging in this manner only strengthen peoples view of the
>>>> power they have. People don't rally against the irrelevant.
>>>>
>>>> Where as just doing what needs to be done, and concentrating
>>>> on spreading the work that is being done, is more beneficial
>>>> and productive than pointing fingers ever could be.
>>>>
>>>> They use fear. We don't have to.
>>>>
>>>> Just my .02btc
>>>>
>>>> Jason
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 1, 2013 11:50 AM, "Cody R Wilson"
>>>> <codywilson@??? <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>
>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> All,
>>>>
>>>> I'm willing to write a longer piece for the magazine, an
>>>> open letter, anything if that is what is called for. I know
>>>> darkwallet.unsystem.net <http://darkwallet.unsystem.net>
>>>> <http://darkwallet.unsystem.net> has more direct criticism,
>>>> but the message in my video toward the foundation is toward a
>>>> particular way of thinking- one featuring our old friend
>>>> ideology.
>>>>
>>>> In talking about the foundation I visuals from Orson Welle's
>>>> film adaption of Kafka's /The Trial/. Joseph K's chief
>>>> naivete throughout his engagement with the state is his sense
>>>> that he can both make a clear account of himself and his life
>>>> and resolve his situation in a way that the process would
>>>> understand as resolved.
>>>>
>>>> The beautiful and terrible irony is that it is K's earnest
>>>> participation that renders him a more visible subject of
>>>> power. No account matters. It is the cooperation, the desire
>>>> for discipline, that leads to his execution.
>>>>
>>>> In this way I believe the video is gentle and honest in its
>>>> criticism. Asking for permission from and trying to explain
>>>> yourself to the legacy powers has only one end.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Amir Taaki
>>>> <genjix@??? <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>
>>>> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Vitalik, this is the story we need to get out:
>>>>
>>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=322483
>>>>
>>>> one of cooperation and mutual solidarity between competitors
>>>> finding middle ground to make effective use of resources.
>>>> this is the power and beauty of openness.
>>>>
>>>>> Thank you Jason, very solid argument. I'm not in favor of
>>>>> burning bridges myself; there are many great people in the
>>>>> foundation (eg. Elizabeth for one, and even Jon Matonis
>>>>> has publicly written
>>>> articles
>>>>> praising System D on numerous occasions), and we should
>>>>> work
>>>> with them
>>>>> to make the foundation better. I looked at the Dark Wallet
>>>> thread inside
>>>>> the foundation forums, and many people are excited about
>>>>> it.
>>>> There is
>>>>> absolutely no reason why we need to reject potential
>>>>> friends.
>>>>>
>>>>> I will consider writing an article myself over the next
>>>>> few
>>>> days or
>>>>> weeks, unless someone else wishes to take this
>>>>> responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11/01/2013 10:37 AM, Jason King wrote:
>>>>>> To The Crew,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't get near enough time to add to the conversation
>>>>>> here.
>>>> That's
>>>>> too bad, I am so in awe of the work that is being done
>>>>> here
>>>> and would
>>>>> love to contribute more.
>>>>>> I first want to congratulate everyone on the indiegogo
>>>> campaign. The
>>>>> initial showing for the fundraiser is quite impressive. I
>>>>> have
>>>> no doubt
>>>>> you will exceed your financial goals on this. I donated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But I can't help but feel you are sacrificing a much
>>>>>> larger
>>>> community
>>>>> impact by not having a more plain words description of the
>>>> benefits of
>>>>> dark wallet. The video is beautiful, well constructed, and
>>>> moving. It
>>>>> does exactly what it was intended to do. I was moved, I
>>>>> agree
>>>> with it's
>>>>> message...I am also /already on this mailing list. /
>>>>>> / / The indiegogo campaign has 133 contributors, that is
>>>>>> not a
>>>> battalion,
>>>>> much less an army. And my feeling is that if the
>>>>> contributor
>>>> list was
>>>>> public I would already be familiar with most of the names
>>>>> on
>>>> the list.
>>>>> People that are already, publicly, aligned with the goals
>>>> stated by this
>>>>> campaign. Dark Wallet and the other ideals championed by
>>>>> this
>>>> group are
>>>>> important and necessary to EVERYBODY. Even the people that
>>>> don't know it
>>>>> yet. And the marketing campaign, in it's current form, is
>>>>> not
>>>> digestible
>>>>> to a large part of the community.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe that's the plan. Maybe you are trying to weed out
>>>>>> certain
>>>>> classes. But that, seems at odds with the ideals expressed
>>>>> here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not saying to stop what you are doing, at all. I'm
>>>>>> saying
>>>> I think
>>>>> there is a great force multiplier to be had by having an
>>>> additional,
>>>>> stripped down version of the message that focuses on just
>>>>> the
>>>> technical
>>>>> benefits of the platform as it is being proposed. The
>>>>> benefits are obvious. They do not need political overtone,
>>>>> fear, or anarchist galvanization to stand on their own
>>>>> merits.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why wouldn't you want trustless mixing?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why wouldn't you want to have alternative full wallet
>>>> implementations
>>>>> free of qt and bitcoind?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why wouldn't you want a more distributed group of
>>>>>> developers
>>>> working
>>>>> on Bitcoin?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Isn't the whole point of Bitcoin to do away with single
>>>>>> point of failure?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> These ideas are powerful, very powerful. The work you
>>>>>> are
>>>> doing IS THE
>>>>> REVOLUTION. The revolution does not need a trumpeter next
>>>>> to
>>>> it saying,
>>>>> YO DAWG THIS IS THE REVOLUTION.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I propose, sometime in the next few weeks, before the
>>>> campaign ends,
>>>>> you run a piece entitled "Shedding Light on Dark Wallet"
>>>>> that just explains all the benefits that Dark Wallet can
>>>>> offer, in very
>>>> plain
>>>>> terms. Just a clean, well put together, article or video
>>>>> that
>>>> explains
>>>>> the offering you are building. Completely free of any
>>>>> other
>>>> ancillary
>>>>> benefit or protection this technology may offer. I think
>>>>> you
>>>> will be
>>>>> shocked at how well something like that will be received.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When you have been breathing smog, oxygen needs no hype
>>>>>> man.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And you say you need work, not ideas. If you guys are
>>>> interested in
>>>>> putting something like that together, I would be privileged
>>>>> to
>>>> help
>>>>> create it and promote it. And I think it will probably
>>>>> shake a
>>>> few more
>>>>> talented workers out of the woodwork.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the end of the day, do we want...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To say fuck the US? Or to build the tools that will
>>>>>> protect
>>>> everyone
>>>>> from their grasp?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To say fuck the Bitcoin Foundation? Or use them as a
>>>>>> speed
>>>> bump to
>>>>> dance with regulators, while we build the infrastructure
>>>>> that
>>>> makes the
>>>>> regulators and the foundation irrelevant?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To say this world is fucked? Or do the work that makes
>>>>>> it better.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I realize I juxtaposed "you" and "we" a lot here. That's
>>>> because I
>>>>> recognize that I have really done nothing to push this
>>>>> forward
>>>> so far,
>>>>> "you" have. But I feel so close to the ideal here, it's
>>>>> hard
>>>> to not see
>>>>> myself in it. I hope you guys will forgive me grammar
>>>> indiscretions. I
>>>>> am in awe of you all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you so much for what you do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jason King Sean's Outpost
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Tristan Winters
>>>>> <tristan_winters@???
>>>> <mailto:tristan_winters@hotmail.com>
>>>> <mailto:tristan_winters@hotmail.com
>>>> <mailto:tristan_winters@hotmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are referring to this:
>>>>> http://www.forbes.com/fdc/welcome_mjx.shtml
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The foundation did not get 9 million dollars. But as soon
>>>>>> as the above company got VC backed, they became a
>>>>> "Gold Member" of the foundation.
>>>>>> And the foundation got a large number of Bitcoins in
>>>>>> that
>>>> way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, this has clearly touched a nerve in the
>>>> community. The
>>>>> crowd-funding 24hr response shows that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 1 Nov 2013, at 2:25 pm, Amir Taaki <genjix@???
>>>> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>
>>>>> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> this article is head in the clouds laa dee da that
>>>>>>> does
>>>> not fit
>>>>> the reality.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> first of all bitcoin foundation should not be involved
>>>>>>> in
>>>>> development of
>>>>>>> bitcoin if that are interacting with the state. that
>>>> means not
>>>>> paying
>>>>>>> salaries to people who exert undue influence over the
>>>> protocol.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> if they choose to continue to be involved with bitcoin
>>>>> development then
>>>>>>> they should also support dark wallet, electrum, and
>>>> hive (which
>>>>> are now
>>>>>>> combining as one project pooling our efforts).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> if they want to be involved in development, then the
>>>> role should
>>>>> be in
>>>>>>> establishing a neutral space (which i have not seen be
>>>> done and
>>>>> have no
>>>>>>> confidence will be done). i want to see more stick.
>>>> I've seen
>>>>> some cliquey
>>>>>>> and sneaky behaviour coming from bitcoind devs.
>>>>>>> multiple
>>>>> instances of
>>>>>>> top-down commands (evoking that power when not
>>>> neccessary) or
>>>>> shutting
>>>>>>> down debate over contentious issues.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> twice i contacted the foundation over issues where I
>>>> was being
>>>>> unfairly
>>>>>>> placed at a disadvantage as a dev because of office
>>>> politics
>>>>> (being taken
>>>>>>> off mailing lists .etc) but they refused to intervene.
>>>> they are
>>>>> paying
>>>>>>> salaries of devs. I would have words if someone I was
>>>> working
>>>>> with was
>>>>>>> acting like a cunt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I told this to elizabeth already, and she's a force
>>>>>>> for
>>>> good
>>>>> working on
>>>>>>> bitcoin with pure motives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> from a journalist friend of ours. he sent me this
>>>> yesterday:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just got a call from the bitcoin foundation. They
>>>> wouldn't go
>>>>> on the
>>>>>>>> record to comment on the article but just kept
>>>>>>>> telling
>>>> me "off
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> record" that you lot have no credibility and that a
>>>> much better
>>>>> story is
>>>>>>>> some venture capitalist yesterday investing $9m in
>>>> bitcoin...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> can't stop laughing. ok, where is this 9 million. what
>>>> is it
>>>>> doing? i
>>>>>>> haven't seen any of it yet. they have all the
>>>>>>> resources,
>>>>> leigitimacy and
>>>>>>> attention but what have they done. they are lost in
>>>>>>> the
>>>> politics.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> we have donations from many, not 1 rich fascist. how
>>>> will this 9
>>>>> million
>>>>>>> be used. the money from the community will go far, be
>>>> collectively
>>>>>>> managed in a multisig and be used well. we don't waste
>>>> 9 million
>>>>>> on
>>>>>>> lawyers giving to people part of the state apparatus.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> why don't they go on record and back up their words?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> godspeed :) today we finally forced an important issue
>>>>>>> in
>>>>> bitcoin to the
>>>>>>> forefront. this is where we will make our stand for
>>>> freedom and
>>>>>> our
>>>>>>> values. great job cody for his mastermind work here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The video is so fucken crazy. Thank God you're a
>>>>>>>> force
>>>> for good.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Another time and place you could work for the
>>>>>>>> propaganda
>>>>> ministry of some
>>>>>>>> Eastern Block country. :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Check this out also, it's a balanced piece doing the
>>>> rounds:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> http://techliberation.com/2013/10/31/bitcoin-is-going-mainstream-here-is-why-cypherpunks-shouldnt-worry/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
On 1 Nov 2013, at 2:01 pm, Cody R Wilson
>>>> <codywilson@??? <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>
>>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu
>>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'd like to thank everyone on this list especially
>>>> for the
>>>>> tremendous
>>>>>>>>> response the Dark Wallet campaign received
>>>>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>> Within
>>>>> 24 hours we
>>>>>>>>> received just over 25k USD in combined
>>>>>>>>> contributions.
>>>> Share
>>>>> the video if
>>>>>>>>> you haven't already. It seems to be popularizing
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>> spirit of
>>>>> crypto.
>>>>>>>>> There is demand!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 2:05 PM, Amir Taaki
>>>> <genjix@??? <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>
>>>>> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net <mailto:genjix@riseup.net>>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Hi!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We're doing a crowd funding campaign for DarkWallet soon.
>>>>>> I'm
>>>> looking
>>>>>> for any material (especially from people here) that we
>>>>>> can
>>>> weave into
>>>>>> a tapestry of our vision and ideals.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How we are thinking, what we are working towards, what
>>>> interests us, ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Articles, videos, images, forum posts, ... anything. We
>>>>>> want to present something to the people
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * It's not only about the 'black market' but tools for
>>>>>> the
>>>> people, the
>>>>>> limitations and the monopoly of money / economy. * Tools
>>>>>> like DarkWallet are your own financial system, a free
>>>> financial
>>>>>> system. * It's important to talk about independence and
>>>>>> community
>>>> (organising
>>>>>> together). * Everything from petrol, food, computers,
>>>>>> even our health is manipulated. * Finance is one aspect,
>>>>>> but we need to take back control of more things. * Silk
>>>>>> Road: $1.2 billion market, 2 murders, >2 years. DPR is
>>>> a hero.
>>>>>> Compare that with something like producing rice and all
>>>>>> the
>>>> people
>>>>>> that die. * More simply: ** Bitcoin = amazing scifi. The
>>>>>> blockchain is incredible. ** No technical limitations.
>>>>>> The limitations are human
>>>> limitations.
>>>>>> ** We will have all the tools, but we need the community.
>>>>>> * Bitcoin Foundation has a lot of money, all the
>>>>>> legitimacy
>>>> but they do
>>>>>> nothing. They are lost in the politics, but aren't
>>>>>> thinking
>>>> of serving
>>>>>> the people. * We are here now working with the future in
>>>>>> mind. These
>>>> things take
>>>>>> time and are slow. Maybe 5 years from now all these
>>>>>> crazy
>>>> concepts
>>>>>> become reality. ** Bitcoin is still young. ** It's also
>>>>>> about the internet. ** Bitcoin is something new but
>>>>>> immensely powerful.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>>>>>
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
- -- Sincerely,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cody R. Wilson codywilson@???
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>
>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu
>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The University of Texas School of Law Class of
>>>>>>>>> 2014
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>>>>>
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM
>>>>>>>> mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM
>>>>>>> mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>>>
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM
>>>>>> mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>>
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM
>>>>>> mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM mailing
>>>>> list: http://unsystem.net
>>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM mailing
>>>> list: http://unsystem.net
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
- -- Sincerely,
>>>>
>>>> Cody R. Wilson codywilson@???
>>>> <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu>
>>>>
>>>> The University of Texas School of Law Class of 2014
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________ unSYSTEM
>>>> mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
_______________________________________________ unSYSTEM mailing
>>>> list: http://unsystem.net
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>
>>>>
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>> list: http://unsystem.net
>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>
>
>
>
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