>     You're reading my mind.

>     My guess is that he's going to be denied bail, or that it will be
>     financially out of reach for friends and family. It's going to be a
>     while before we find out what really went on.

>     On 10/04/2013 05:54 PM, Caleb James DeLisle wrote:
>     > Lets play a little 'what if' game. I know next to nothing about
>     silkroad so
>     > I'm probably going to get something wrong but bare with me.
>     >
>     > What if Ross is as innocent as he could be while still being the
>     operator
>     > of silkroad. Just a sort of craigslist with escrow. Now what if
>     the FBI got
>     > a message from an anonymous TOR person that said "Hi, I'm Ross
>     Ulbricht, I run
>     > silkroad and I would like you to murder someone". In court this
>     is not going
>     > to stand up for one moment but they entered the information in
>     their criminal
>     > complaint so he is already convicted of murder in the minds of many.

>     >
>     > Maybe the FBI agents heard this and they "saw what they wanted
>     to see" in it,
>     > maybe they intentionally added this to the complaint to foil
>     attempts at raising
>     > money in his defense, we don't know.

>     >
>     > What if they ammend their complain removing any word of murder
>     for hire and
>     > direct drug dealing and charge him only for his role in
>     operating SR? What if
>     > they encounter very little legal defense because those who might
>     have donated
>     > have already written him off as a murderer?

>     >

>     >
>     > All I have to say is please lets not rush to judgement, if he is
>     guilty of
>     > murder then he will probably be found guilty, hopefully to be
>     humainly confined
>     > as is the norm among civil societies. If he was only a peaceful
>     operator of a
>     > forum, another Aaron Swartz, a person who only broke the law to
>     change things,
>     > then his sentencing should reflect not just his actions but his
>     *intent*,
>     > something which is unlikely if he cannot mount an effective defense.

>     >

>     >
>     > Thanks,
>     > Caleb

>     >

>     >
>     > On 10/04/2013 11:19 AM, Robert Williamson wrote:
>     >> I bet last week they would also have said zero chance of being
>     an online drug lord.

>     >>
>     >> Sure the FBI entrapped him. But are his parents saying that
>     entrapment never happened and the chat/ message logs are faked?

>     >>
>     >> On 4 Oct 2013 16:12, "Mike Gogulski" <mike@???
>     <mailto:mike@gogulski.com> <mailto:mike@gogulski.com
>     <mailto:mike@gogulski.com>>> wrote:

>     >>
>     >>     I spoke with his parents for two hours:

>     >>

>     >>    
>     https://www.rossulbricht.org/ross-ulbrichts-parents-say-zero-chance-of-murder-for-hire/

>     >>
>     >>     On 10/04/2013 12:41 PM, Juraj Bednar wrote:
>     >>     > Hi,

>     >>     >
>     >>     >> The Maryland document clearly states it was an
>     undercover FBI agent.

>     >>     >>
>     >>     > Yet it clearly says that the undercover agent arranged
>     the delivery, but
>     >>     > the first person to suggest
>     >>     > torture and then execution was DPR. I still want to
>     believe that that's
>     >>     > not the whole story, on the
>     >>     > other hand, it's a great PR move for influencing the jury.

>     >>     >
>     >>     > >From the state point of view, the FBI did their job and
>     after they've
>     >>     > done it, DPR suggested violence.
>     >>     > (of course we view the acts of the FBI as violence, but
>     that's not what
>     >>     > the general public believes
>     >>     > and it serves their narrative pretty well :(.

>     >>     >
>     >>     >> In most countries in the world, entrapment is thrown out
>     of court. You
>     >>     >> cannot prosecute someone for a crime which the police
>     entrap you into.
>     >>     > Yet there is nothing to suggest so. In Maryland document,
>     there was even
>     >>     > no indication of threats
>     >>     > from the "victim" about releasing documents. DPR was
>     pissed that they
>     >>     > stole some money and that
>     >>     > they could "sing".

>     >>     >
>     >>     > Sort-of prisoner's dilemma, but clearly no direct
>     reaction to any
>     >>     > particular threat.
>     >>     >> They aren't basing their case on attempted murder. So
>     what was the
>     >>     >> purpose of engineering this situation with DPR?
>     >>     > Influence of jury decision and public opinion of course.
>     >>     >> Go and research what DPR is like as a person. Watch his
>     interview
>     >>     >> online where he is talking about true love and his hopes
>     for the
>     >>     >> future of the world. Read some his writings.
>     >>     > His writings are writings of an idealist. We all read it
>     and believed
>     >>     > that it says what we
>     >>     > think. There is always a difference between what someone
>     writes and what
>     >>     > he or she
>     >>     > does. This is not to blame or to praise Ross as a person.
>     DPR was and is
>     >>     > an act.
>     >>     > It may root from his beliefs, but he will be judged as a
>     person based on
>     >>     > his actions,
>     >>     > not based on his beliefs.

>     >>     >
>     >>     > We can discuss if the trial is unbiased and serves
>     justice and not only
>     >>     > the state. It will
>     >>     > almost certainly be biased on the state side, because the
>     state sees
>     >>     > drug trade as
>     >>     > something bad and some people including me, most of the
>     vendors and
>     >>     > customers
>     >>     > and himself see it otherwise.

>     >>     >
>     >>     > Ross was a real person and they are basing their
>     >>     > case on real person and his mistakes. They are winning
>     the public
>     >>     > opinion part pretty
>     >>     > well. :(
>     >>     >> Interview with DPR (left):
>     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33fxHA-FEYg

>     >>     >>
>     >>     > This is an interview with Ross and I believe these are
>     different
>     >>     > entities. We may discuss
>     >>     > if DPR or Ross was an act, but one of them was.
>     >>     >> By judging DPR, you are buying the picture that has been
>     painted for
>     >>     >> you to slant the public discourse. Remove yourself from
>     that game.
>     >>     >> This moral dilemma is false.
>     >>     > The dilemma is not false.

>     >>     >
>     >>     > But I agree we cannot judge DPR because we have no
>     unbiased information
>     >>     > regarding the
>     >>     > case and we don't have any moral authority to judge him.

>     >>     >
>     >>     > Where are the victims? Let them speak or show that they
>     are missing.
>     >>     > Otherwise, it's a witch-hunt.

>     >>     >

>     >>     >
>     >>     >    J.

>     >>     >

>     >>     >
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>     >>

>     >>

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