Hmm, my gut feeling is that with 64 Gb of RAM you should be able to run 4 browser processes, each with many tabs open (tens, maybe hundreds) and each tab running javascript and talking to hundreds of domains. I wouldn't consider that particularly taxing for a modern system. Maybe it could overload the kernel's network subsystem if there are hundreds of thousands of sockets but I wouldn't think so. You could get an idea of the overall network load by running ifconfig and observing the packet counts. If they are increasing by stupid numbers (hundreds of thousands per second) then maybe you are overloading the kernel. But really I think that is not your issue. It seems to me more that if you exercise your CPU, RAM and mobo more then you get more crashes. Why not try some benchmarking software? And something to exercise the video card and driver like a modern game?



As regards getting off gmail (is that mz googly? Mz says microsoft to me but that may be because dos exe's started with mz). I run iRedmail (free version) and I cannot praise this software highly enough. What you need is a blank vps (I used ubuntu but i think devuan would be fine) and you run the iredmail script and it builds you a mail server. Administering this mail server is not trivial but also not that difficult. A challenge is to implement the magic incantations eg in your dns records, to get gmail to accept your mail, i did this with some research and effort.



Kind regards, Nick







>
> On 29 Sept 2024 at 5:01 pm, dng-request <dng-request@???> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. Re: Learning C (books) (o1bigtenor)
> 2. Re: Uptime issue (o1bigtenor)
> 3. Re (2): Learning C (books) (peter@???)
> 4. Re: unresponsive machine (terryc)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2024 21:09:19 -0500
> From: o1bigtenor <o1bigtenor@???>
> Cc: dng@???
> Subject: Re: [DNG] Learning C (books)
> Message-ID:
> <CAPpdf5-seivL_eEgvOzDyj637hSdTECg3y0iLtVE3+u5cVepuQ@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> On Sat, Sep 28, 2024 at 4:40?PM Wm. Moss via Dng <dng@???> wrote:
>
> > On 9/28/24 17:04, R A Montante, Ph.D. via Dng wrote:
> > >>> Hi,
> > >>> I would recommend:
> > >>>
> > >>> The C Programming Language (sometimes termed K&R, after its authors'
> > >>> initials) is a computer programming book written by Brian Kernighan
> > >>> and Dennis Ritchie
> > >> No no no no NO! The preceding book is the ultimate reference, but it's
> > >> horrible to learn from. I know: I tried for a year to learn from K&R
> > >> version 1, and couldn't. Then I got something called "The C Puzzle
> > >> Book", and learned. But these days, with the web, I don't think a book
> > >> is necessary except for telling you best practices, but initial
> > >> learning is best done without worrying about best practices.
> > >>
> > >> Speaking of best practices, IIRC the K&R code examples are terse and
> > >> cute but horribly unreadable.
> > >>
> > >> SteveT
> > > Different strokes for different folks. I loved learning C from K&R.
> > > Every time I hit a problem, a careful reading of the relevant parts
> > > always explained it. But that was me (and in a very different era),
> > > and as I am currently teaching C I know that many of my students need
> > > more structural support in learning I did. I've just starting using
> > > an online textbook instead of only my own notes, and most of them seem
> > > to like having something they can refer to when they're on their own.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Bob Montante
> > > The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real
> > numbers.
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Dng mailing list
> > > Dng@???
> > > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
> >
> > I have been using C since around 1978.
> >
> > The original manual (which I still have), "A Programmer's Work Bench" is
> > clear about its intended audience and purpose, it is aimed at system
> > programming and as a replacement for assembly language, a portable
> > assembler.
> >
> > I also have multiple articles from the Bell Labs Journals. All, however
> > written for an audience with advanced engineering and/or math degrees (a
> > Bell Labs MTS) and are not particularly useful for general consumption.
> >
> > I taught C programming at Bell Labs and AT&T and in Universities after
> > retiring. I have also written a considerable amount of code, mostly for
> > embedded system and OS core service.
> >
> > In my opinion, most people who code should not be using a language that
> > allows for pointer access, pointer arithmetic, and the other low level
> > access and side effects that are built into the language. That said,
> > there are to my knowledge no good Algol based languages in common use.
> > Pascal and its progeny (Modular, Modular-2, Modular-3) never caught on
> > and the original Iron Man became a horror of complexity as Ada. The
> > current P-Code languages such as Python and Java are, for me, too slow
> > and exhibit an annoying syntax. Propriety languages such as PL/I could
> > have succeeded if their parent companies had released them into the
> > public domain.
> >
> > Therefore, I guess C is all that is available for coding ELF
> > applications. As such, I would strongly recommend reading all one can
> > find on the Internet. Every C book I have reviewed that is reasonably
> > understandable leaves out or glosses over some of the truly useful
> > language constructs. What is most often missing are proper use of a
> > union rather then casting, the use of an atexit stack and signals for
> > minimizing crashes, the extensive memory monitoring library and the
> > ability to start the program prior to main() so the signal masks and
> > memory monitors can be started prior to the operational code.
> >
> > I still have the syllabus from the undergraduate class I taught. Its
> > badly out of date but perhaps I can update it and post it on some public
> > forum.
> >
> > As the 'turkey' that started this somewhat diverging group of threads I
> would be quite interested in such a syllabus.
>
> (Maybe we'll get you writing a book yet - - - - grin! )
>
> TIA
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2024 21:20:50 -0500
> From: o1bigtenor <o1bigtenor@???>
> Cc: dng <dng@???>
> Subject: Re: [DNG] Uptime issue
> Message-ID:
> <CAPpdf58EwM_m7XpVphT_eD-MxKcHQVXY2cOK=8HtnJ_grvnV7Q@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> On Sat, Sep 28, 2024 at 8:15?PM nick <nick@???> wrote:
>
> > It's definitely a dream system. I would still suspect it though. My
> > reasoning would be somewhat like this:
> > 1. Random lockups are not normal and shouldn't be happening.
> > 2. The cause has gotta be either hardware or software.
> > 3. If it's hardware it's gotta be one (or more) specific component that is
> > failing, defined by if I replaced that component with an identical unit (of
> > the same manufacturer and model) the problem would go away.
> > 4. If it's software it's gotta be a subtle bug or driver incompatibility,
> > sometimes latent bugs can be triggered by unusual combinations eg. Let us
> > say the driver for your AMD graphics card fails when there is 64 GB or more
> > of RAM, just for the sake of example.
> > 5. It could also be a matter of settings or configuration eg if your BIOS
> > has configured the RAM for a higher clock than it is specced for, although
> > in this era of autoconfiguration this would probably count as a driver bug.
> >
> > What I would do as a starting point would be to pull out the GPU and half
> > the RAM and use it for a few weeks to see if problem goes away. Does it
> > have internal graphics or do you have an older GPU to use temporarily? If
> > problem recurs swap the RAM for the other half and re-test. You can also
> > try the GPU or RAM in another system to see if problem moves with it. If it
> > turns out to be the GPU then it could be driver issue as drivers are very
> > complex these days. You could try earlier driver or earlier kernel (as you
> > are already doing) but such approach is fraught. Once you narrow down the
> > issue to a specific part or driver its better to take it out of service
> > until a new part or fix is available.
> >
> > In principle you can use the same approach to diagnose CPU or mobo issue,
> > but you would need identical spares which could get costly. If buying
> > spares for testing I would highly recommend to get a PSU first. I haven't
> > been into system building for many years but I have heard that PSU is
> > responsible for a large proportion of faults with modern rigs given how
> > demanding they are on the PSU.
> >
> > I am sure you can solve this. The nightmare is when it happens on a laptop
> > where you really have no option but to try earlier kernels or removing
> > drivers or take the laptop out of service (has happened to me). On a PC it
> > is much easier. Oh yeah another thought: you might try running the dreaded
> > Windows on it for a while. If it still locks up you have eliminated
> > software except possibly for common code in AMD display drivers.
> >
> >
> Given that when I had all four browsers loaded the uptime shrank horribly
> and my peripheral knowledge of the
> desire of far too many companies to use javascript to do things and report
> back to them what they want to know
> I am far more likely to suspect software than hardware.
>
> Just like right now - - I am still stuck at the dredded mz googly's email
> system and right now ublock origin is
> telling me that the are some 115 domains linked in. (Now up to 120 domains.
> Now up to 137!!!!)
> This kind of garbage is likely at the bottom of my issues - - - not that
> hardware can't be an issue but
> when hardware is manipulated by unscrupulous companies - - - well the
> results are issues for users.
>
> Sorry - - - I have no spare GPU and I don't know another currently
> available one that has 5 outputs
> so that's a doa issue already.
> I guess what I'm looking for - - - well maybe I need to setup that shared
> hosting setup that I have been thinking
> about and get mz googly off my neck. Then if I can find a way to jail any
> and all browsers then I think my
> hardware issues would like shrink mightily.
>
> Any suggestions on how I can jail any browser?
>
> Thanks for the ongoing support!
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: 28 Sep 2024 21:39:57 -0700
> From: peter@???
> To: dng@???
> Subject: [DNG] Re (2): Learning C (books)
> Message-ID: <mailman.4673.1727593262.6705.dng@???>
>
> From: "Wm. Moss via Dng" <dng@???>
> Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2024 17:40:06 -0400
> > ... Modular ...
>
> Modula.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modula
>
> Regards, ... P.
> --
> VoIP: +1 604 670 0140
> work: https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/User:PeterEasthope
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2024 17:00:54 +1000
> From: terryc <terryc@???>
> To: dng@???
> Subject: Re: [DNG] unresponsive machine
> Message-ID: <20240929170054.1dd42475@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> On Sat, 28 Sep 2024 12:22:26 -0500
> o1bigtenor via Dng <dng@???> wrote:
>
> >
> > I'm running a:
> > 1. AMD Ryzen 7 5800X 8-core proc
> > 2. AMD Ellesmere 570X graphics card (it has 5 outputs!!!)
>
> What is the RAMM on the gpu?
> Is it enough for all the desktops/screens you are running?
>
> > 3. 64 GB of ram
> > 4. NVME drive for the system
> > 5. SSDs for /usr, /var/, usr/local, swap, /home
> > 6. power supply was rated at 1500 or 1600 VA (which is total bs but
> > that's another story!!)
> >
> > System is only somewhat over 2 years old.
> >
> > So - - - dunno if its a hardware insufficiency although maybe - - - I
> > might be taxing the
> > graphics card too heavily (its a 7640 x 3000 pixel screen on X11).
>
> What vision depth?
>
> >
> > back over to you
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
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> End of Dng Digest, Vol 120, Issue 57
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>