# Devuan meet 2021-10-07 @20:30 UTC

Present: LeePen, plasma41, rrq, bb|hcb, Beer, jaromil, Hendrik

Regrets: fsmithred, golinux (in and quickly out)

## Old Business

### golinux
* jaromil informed me that the devuan.net transfer is in process.
  * (Beer) Domain is in `Pending transfer` status. Having gotten in
    touch with my registrar, there is now way to expedite things, hence
    transfer won't be completed before 2021-10-12

### jaromil Validation of the transfer of devuan.net by the former
provider status: ``` We are waiting for your current provider to
accept or refuse this transfer. It should arrive in your account
before Oct 13, 2021 unless they refuse it. ``` so should be
transferred soon!

## Old Actions

### Beer
* Created bugs for `devuan-www`:
* https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=612
* https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=613 and PRs:
* https://git.devuan.org/devuan/www.devuan.org/pulls/15
* https://git.devuan.org/devuan/www.devuan.org/pulls/16
* https://git.devuan.org/devuan/tellpackage/pulls/2
* https://git.devuan.org/devuan/tellpackage/pulls/3

## New Business

### LeePen
* started on Release Notes.
  https://git.devuan.org/devuan/documentation/src/branch/wip/chimaera_release_notes.md
  * (gl) Sadly I am visually crippled by that presentation and unable to
    to make sense of what's going on there. :( That is an observation
    not a complaint.  Thanks for actually DOING something towards the
    chimaera release which is inching up on us. Carry on! (LeePen) I
    have just changed the file extension so that gitea renders the
    markdown nicely. Try again:
    https://git.devuan.org/devuan/documentation/src/branch/wip/chimaera_release_notes.md/release-docs/Release_notes_chimaera_4.0.0.md
    * (gl) You are a wonder! THANK YOU! Did a quick read. #devuan is
      mainly a support channel for specific issues rather than general
      devuan discussion which can quickly go off the rails. Will read
      more carefully later.
  * (rrq) just a note against confusion: that url is to the git store's
    web gui access to the editing place for that document (viewed via
    markup processing that is triggered by the file extension being
    "md"). The document should also have a **publishing place**
    somewhere on www.d.o as well as being included in the local /docs
    directory on the installer ISOs. The links in that document should
    be coded so that they point out the publishing places of all
    documents it refers to as well as, where applicable, self-relative
    urls for any of the local /docs documents it refers to. (I *think*
    those are all correctly coded in this document source, but I haven't
    verified)
* Updated base-files in ceres to add codename to /etc/os-release. Still
  needs /etc/devuan_version change for chimaera release.

### Hendrik
* Reviewed the beta.devuan.org site.  Found broken links, likely pages
  still in construction
  * on beta.devian.org"
    * the Chimaera 4.0 link goes noplace
  * on beta.devuan.org/os/install
    * Devuan Chimaera Release Notes -- 404 Not Found
    * Upgrade from Devuan Beowulf -- Document not found
    * Migrate from Debian Bullseye -- Document not found
      * (gl) No surprise there.  Nearly two weeks on from the failed
        attempt to get those files in place and no measurable progress.
        :(

### golinux
* Attention rrq . . . This just posted on irc. Is a repo missing in the
  installer iso?  And is pkgmaster still being offered as an option
  during installation? Shouldn't that be removed?
  * zeron: Hey guys! I'd like to report something that MIGHT be a bug:
    installing a barebones system from Chimaera netinstall.iso with
    expert install creates an incomplete sources.list file -- it does
    not include the main repo `deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged
    chimaera` -- it's just isn't there. All the others are present --
    chimaera-updates, chimaera-security and even chimaera-backports, but
    not the main one.
  * zeron: During the installation there was a question of wether to use
    deb.devuan.org or pkgmaster.-something...  But no other question
    relating to sources.
  * rwp: golinux, I just ran through a basic install using
    devuan_chimaera_4.0.beta-20211004_i386_netinstall.iso and resulted
    in this https://paste.debian.net/plain/1214655 sources.list file.
  * rwp: At the sources dialog I selected deb.devuan.org not pkgmaster
    but pkgmaster still appeared for the security lines.
  * (gl) more notes from rwp on #devuan . . .
  * (rrq) yes, there are a couple of ways one can mess up ones
    sources.list file of the installed system, but at least the "normal"
    ways of using the ISOs avoid that. Afair there are two udebs
    involved that prepare the installed sources.list (choose-mirror and
    whatever the other one is, apt-setup maybe). Both of those are
    forked, and not changed recently. It remains possible that some
    installed package make its own editing of sources.list while
    installing, but that's not something the netinstall installer ISO
    can guard against.
  * (rrq) I don't know the arguments and decision logic behind using
    pkgmaster.devuan.org for "chimaera-security" instead of using the
    user's selected repository source (which defaults to
    deb.devuan.org). That source line also defaults to include both
    "contrib" and "non-free" (in addition to "main") whereas the primary
    source line only includes "main" by default. Notably, if the
    installer is run in non-default mode the installer offers further
    choices for the primary source line. And of course, anyone may also
    inflict personal choices by manual editing before or after first
    boot of the installed system.

### plasma41
* I'm working on getting the website ready for Chimaera with install
  guides and such. I posted a rough draft of the new pages for the
  chimaera install guides for the website yesterday as
  https://git.devuan.org/devuan/www.devuan.org/pulls/17. I've already
  received some feedback of needed changes, but more feedback is
  welcome.
  * (gl) Did you see the notes that I left you on irc www? The install
    instructions on that webpage need to be modified for inclusion into
    the www presentation.  The file itself cannot be used on the web
    presentation.  I would probably modify the beowulf version and make
    textual edits (if any) there rather than having to redo the markup
    from the iso-docs to fit into the website.

## New Actions

### `deb.devuan.org` `RR` contents
* (Beer) It seems onefang is the go-to person on that matter. Tried to
  reach out to him on 2021-10-07 during the meeting; no answer so far. I
  would gladly give a hand in such matter, knowing about/being
  interested in it 🙃
  * (gl) https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/mirror_list.txt
    https://sledjhamr.org/apt-panopticon/results/Report-web.html
    * (Beer) Related to the file modified by [PR
      devuan/www.devuan.org#16](https://git.devuan.org/devuan/www.devuan.org/pulls/16)?
      Someone mentioned the offending mirror was *not* in the
      `deb.devuan.org` pool, meaning that file might be outdated.

#### Document
* (Beer) It might be interesting/useful to document this record in a
  _source of truth_ piece of documentation somewhere (for instance, in
  the `devuan/infrastructure_doc` repository on `git.devuan.org`?)
  * (gl) It seems you are unfamiliar with Devuan resources. All pad
    notes are published and archived at the devuan-dev email archives.
    https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/mindex/devuan-dev@20380101.000000.00000000.en.html
    If a wiki ever happens they could be replicated there also.
  * (gl) In addition, it is rather insulting that you would suggest a
    "source_of_truth" as opposed to an "archive" because that wording
    implies a concern about "untruth" amongst the Devuan team. That is
    toxic. If that is your world outside of Devuan, please leave it at
    the door. It has no place here.

#### Homogeneise zone management
* (Beer) rrq mentioned this record was managed separately from the rest
  of the `devuan.org` zone. rrq also mentioned an initiative aiming at
  merging it back from ~1 year ago stalled. It might be interesting to
  resurrect that idea/resume process?
  * (gl) And how is any this helping to get Chimaera out the door?
    Can't it wait until after the release? Bureaucracy just plain sucks
    and IMO will be the death of this project.
    * (plasma41) Please don't shout people down just for voicing
      questions about things other than the current Most Important
      Thing. It's not benefitial and discourages people from engaging in
      the project. (gl) As I said before, at release time, we used to
      all pull in the same direction. How times change . . . I would
      like to propose (at jaromil's suggestion after today's meet) that
      the ops people have meetings separate from the weekly Devuan meet
      to be arranged at the convenience of those involved. He said that
      works for his projects.

### targeting Monday 11 Oct 2021, at 15:08 UTC for first RC isos.
* (gl) Hallelujah! (Let's see if it disappears again)

### plasma taking on responsibility for merging website stuff
* (plasma41) Please yell at me gently ;-)
  * (gl) Just make sure that you have actually LOOKED at the pages
    locally before you merge them.  You CAN do this! It is more work
    than you might expect though . . . It needs to be done asap!

### Infrastructure
* (Beer) Offered to help; Will address details about infrastructure
access directly with rrq