On 2018-09-30 16:01, Daniel Reurich wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I think this is simply someone in Debian recognising that they have
> holes in information about derivatives.
>
Really? Can't they read the website? I'm getting more sense of
"capture".
> My thoughts are that we should participate, as it will do a lot to help
> smooth things over and give credence to our concerns, and be seen to be
> cooperative with debian.
>
I thought we have always been cooperative with Devuan and that the lack
of cooperation was on Debian's side.
>
> Also by listing Devuan as an official derivative of Debian, we gain a
> big benefit in allaying the concern that we are a small team
> maintaining
> a big distribution on it's own. (I have had this discussion with some
> of my clients, who were concerned about Devuans sustainability. What
> convinced them to allow my use of Devuan for their systems was that
> most
> Debian packages are used unchanged, and where there where changes they
> are trivial changes to the Debian sources in order to remove the binary
> dependency of systemd.
>
> From what I can tell looking at the CensusQA templates, they will
> actually inform us of issues and announcements as they arise which
> would
> be very useful.
>
Possibly good for your business but it is good for Devuan?
>
> Thus I think there is nothing to lose and much to gain by participating
> in the process. It will provide us with much needed information about
> what is going on in Debian, and provide us with a better relationship
> from which we can assert the need to prevent debian maintainers from
> going out of their way to break non-systemd packages.
>
I'm not so sure about that. When have they ever listened to us?
>
> I'd be happy to take the lead in getting us listed as a derivative of
> Debian.
Well, if you want to take it on in your spare time [/sarcasm] . . .
> (This does not mean we are walking back in any way the claim to
> have forked Debian, just acknowledging Devuans heritage, and continuing
> commonality with debian.)
>
I think it does take us a step back. Debian would LOVE to
minimize/trivialize what we're doing. Once we're pigeon-holed as a
derivative how will we ever break through back to independence as a fork
if it comes to that? I think the derivative label would stick and
Debian might even try to require changes of how we describe ourselves
disallowing the use of "fork". In my world I "trust no one" who has
betrayed me once.
Let's discuss further at the Wed. meet.
>
> Regards,
> Daniel.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 30/09/18 21:20, Jaromil wrote:
>>
>> dear devs,
>>
>> we receive this from a Debian volunteer
>>
>> do we want to enter the census as a 'derivative'?
>>
>> I disagree with this, since I think we are not, but ask you here
>> nevertheless
>>
>> also there is a strange detail in this mail, which was sent in HTML
>> and rendered by my mail client using w3m: the first link to devuan.org
>> has a href pointing to mxlinux.org. I really hope they won't include
>> us by mistake with a wrong link now.
>>
>> curious about your opinion. the origin of the mail is left out for
>> privacy (is a personal gmail account for some reason)
>>
>> ----- Forwarded message -----
>>
>> Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2018 13:17:12 +0530
>> To: onelove@???
>> Cc: debian-derivatives@???
>> Subject: Devuan: invitation to join the Debian derivatives census
>>
>> Hi,
>> I note that you are producing a software distribution based on
>> Debian.
>>
>> [1]https://devuan.org/
>> [2]https://www.debian.org/
>>
>> I would like to invite you to add your distribution to the Debian
>> derivatives census, which attempts to gather detailed information
>> about Debian derivatives that is useful to Debian, for integration
>> of
>> that information into Debian infrastructure and for the development
>> of
>> relationships between Debian and our derivatives. In addition we
>> will
>> be doing some QA on the data that you enter into the census.
>>
>> [3]https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/Census
>> [4]https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/Integration
>> [5]https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/CensusQA
>>
>> Please direct any questions you have to the derivatives list or IRC
>> channel. We strongly encourage you to join both of these.
>>
>> [6]https://lists.debian.org/debian-derivatives
>> ircs://[7]irc.oftc.net/debian-derivatives
>> Thanks
>>
>> References
>>
>> Visible links
>> 1. https://mxlinux.org/
>> 2. https://www.debian.org/
>> 3. https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/Census
>> 4. https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/Integration
>> 5. https://wiki.debian.org/Derivatives/CensusQA
>> 6. https://lists.debian.org/debian-derivatives
>> 7. http://irc.oftc.net/debian-derivatives
>>
>> ----- End forwarded message -----
::
Re: [devuan-dev] [Fwd] Devuan: invi…
