On Thu, Sep 07, 2017 at 05:25:47PM +0200, Enrico Weigelt, metux IT consult wrote:
> IMHO, even this discussion isn't strictly related to devuan

That's why we're talking on dng not on devuan-dev.

The latter is for development of Devuan specifically.
The former came with the slogan "campfire for systemd refugees".

> it's still related to the bigger picture, why FOSS exists at all.

Why would anyone bother to use free software if you have no free hardware to
run it on? Hardware with merely closed internal workings but well-defined
programmer-facing specs has been so far considered acceptable, but nowadays
we're faced with hardware that actively works against you! Security is
simply not possible on such gear.

> Actually, I'm very happy w/ the things posted here (*incl* the OTs).

I'd consider a discussion of bind vs nsd, or user questions somewhat OT
(even if usually helpful). I don't see how talk about direct threats
towards openness of development would be against the spirit of such list --
be that replacing half of the system with an opaque unmodular blob with bugs
unfixable[1] for an outsider, so are backdoors or DRM in the hardware.

> Maybe we could split the list into multiple ones, for several topic
> types. (eg. strictly technical ones, like packages/patches, general
> discussions, etc)

There's probably not enough traffic for separating user-facing stuff yet;
strictly packaging stuff already has a list of its own.

Also, note my sig: it has the swirl rather than the chevron in it. All of
Devuan development I do migrates through Debian first. Yet I don't have a
feeling of being unwelcome here.

And, I guess it's up to Jaromil and co to declare what's acceptable here:
they're the owners of this list after all.

I do understand your anger about a spat between someone calling another
poster a Purism shill while the other person derided Talos in turn. That
was ugly. But, if you exclude this shout-fest, the rest of the thread was
worth the electrons it came on.


Meow!

[1]. Taking too much effort, for someone with decent general programming
skills but unfamiliar with the system in question, makes such a system
too closed to be allowed to live.  I'm not a kernel dev yet I can fix easy
kernel problems -- no such thing with systemd.
-- 
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