On Tue, Aug 22, 2017 at 5:59 PM, Steve Litt <slitt@???>
wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Fvwm is a lightweight GOSFUI
> (Graphical Operating System Facing User
> Interface (http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/gosfui.htm)) that is
>
A user interface that faces a graphical operating system... I don't
understand the choice of words picked here. I followed the link but it
didn't really help. I'm not sure which words are supposed to be modifying
which other words. I think I grasp how you want the term to be used, but
every time I see the new acronym come up I have to google it again to find
out what it is.

Anyway, I dont think a new term is needed. Then again, I've never had a
conversation where someone disagreed with the use of KDE in response to a
question about the window manager being used except when they disagreed
with the use of KDE in general.

extremely configurable and extensible. Not many people use it, but
> those who do love it. The trouble is, it's very difficult to configure,
>
I suppose the people that *continue* to use it do love it. I certainly
can't find anything better.


> and configuration tips and instructions are handed down from mentor to
> mentee with secret handshakes and incantations. There's almost no web
> documentation suitable for someone not already an expert.
>
Yeah, there are lots of configs you can borrow from, and these are on the
web, but I'm not sure what you mean by web documentation. The man page is
pretty good and the forums are pretty good. There's a sort of wiki hosted
on the forum site, too. That has some smaller more digestible pieces to it
but it's still somewhat intimidating. There are a bunch of user pages that
talk about how to configure it, too. I suppose it's a victim of its own
incredibly configurable nature. The language is simple, but it can do so
many things that expressing it becomes complex very quickly.

Nevertheless, Devuan has a very nice fvwm package that doesn't work
> until one copies a file, and then works great.

What? It works without copying any files. It worked out of the box on the
different devuan systems where I installed it. Some were beta installs,
some were debian jessie to devuan jessie migrations, and some were ...err
normal? installs.


> Today I managed to
> integrate dmenu in with fvwm, creating a highly productive interface.
>
Could I see your configuration file? Other than adding a key to launch
dmenu I'm curious to see what you've added. I'm always looking for cool
features to add to my own config.


> I found a couple issues with Devuan Jessie's Display Manager screen
> that make using fvwm (or anything but the default) just a little more
> difficult:
>
> 1) "Press F1 to select session"
>
> 2) Choice of GOSFUI is not sticky
>
> As far as #1, what the hell does "session" mean?

As pointed out in other replies, the session is a session in the context of
X. Or more simply, it's the thing that when it exits you'll be sitting at
the login again.


> A session is something that runs for awhile, and usually the implication
> is it's already
> running.

Yeah, a session is certainly something that runs for a while, but no, it
does not imply that it's already running.

I think the word "session" needs to be changed to "GOSFUI".

No, session is more appropriate here. Your new term is more restrictive
than what can actually be launched.


> If
> you'd rather not use a word directly created to handle the exact
> concept, you could substitute "window manager or desktop environment".
>
No, this wouldn't be correct. You can launch something other than a window
manager or a desktop environment as your session. For example, a kiosk, or
single full screen application instead of a window manager.


> To articulate just "window manager" or just "desktop environment" is to
> create arguments, and also could lead to errors in very literal
> thinking people.
>
That doesn't apply here. It's also a good argument for not changing it
from session.


> #2 is bad because:
>

> a) Most other display managers default to the last GOSFUI that was run,
>    not to the distro's default.

>
This isn't necessarily bad, just different. Perhaps it's unexpected, but
it is a somewhat sane default.

> b) People preferring not to use the distro's default are going to get
>    mighty tired of F1-ing around the GOSFUI loop in order to pick their
>    choice.

>
I generally edit the /etc/slim.conf file to just execute the .xinitrc file
from the user's home directory. When you edit the file it actually does a
decent job of explaining how to change it. Then my .xinitrc file does a
bunch of customization (xmodmap, xrdb, xset...) and finally calls fvwm.

I would be curious to hear how others handle this when they wish to
customize their session.