On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 11:12:12 +0000
Simon Hobson <linux@???> wrote:


> > I fear many people won't agree with me, but I think it's better to
> > cooperate with Debian than to fight Debian.

Peace is always my default policy, but what if those you cooperate with
have a pattern and practice of forever doing ever more outrageous stuff?

> > Debian has a nice
> > infrastructure. If we will be able to build a Debian extension and
> > not a Debian fork, I think we can all win. On one side we will be
> > able to use Debian's infrastructure and have influence on what's
> > going on there, on the other side Debian will have a nice and fully
> > supported non-systemd version.

[snip]

> I can see several reasons it won't/can't happen - all political !
>
> 1) Some people here are so "entrenched" in their beliefs that such
> "consorting with the enemy" won't be popular.

Hey, you've just described me!

> 2) Some people in
> Debian are so entrenched that such a heretic sub-project would not be
> allowed.

Hey, you've just described the powers that be at Debian. And Redhat.
And Arch.

> 3) It would appear that some people here are persona
> non-gratis on Debian mailing lists

Hey, you just described me again.

> (I don't know why, I can only
> assume for being vocally anti-systemd),

Correct!

> that doesn't bode well for
> them being accepted back.

Oh, all I'd need to do to get accepted back is apologize to Don
Armstrong and promise him I won't do it again. That will happen some
time after the sun burns out.

I would *never* try to stand in the way of closer Devuan/Debian
cooperation. But, I fear, for Devuan, that such a closer cooperation
would turn out to be a trap in the long term.

Devuan's unique. There are several sans-systemd alternatives, but
Devuan is the only one I would recommend to someone not intimately
familiar with the internals of Linux and POSIX. Devuan's future must be
protected.

SteveT

Steve Litt
January 2016 featured book: Twenty Eight Tales of Troubleshooting
http://www.troubleshooters.com/28