On 23/08/15 20:34, Adam Borowski wrote:
> Today on #debconf:
>
> 20:11 < paultag> devuan can pick a fight once they release
> 20:11 < paultag> Hell, they can pick a fight once they stop installing systemd by default
> 20:11 < paultag> which they still do
>
> Guys... _still_ installing systemd by default is pathethic. I provided a
> set of desystemdized de-libsystemd0-ed packaged half a year ago (deb-src
> http://angband.pl/debian nosystemd-{jessie,stretch}), and other than upower,
> it was a matter of a bunch of trivial changes to debian/{control,rules,...}.
>
> The time frame becomes bad... you don't want to be laughed at, do you?
>

I felt like I was being laughed at some time ago, when I posted that I
always re-compile the packages that I use to remove systemd unit files
before I install those packages. I know that they are harmless if we
installed them on non-systemd Linux. But it is a matter of principle to
me that having those unit files on my PC means that I am still
supporting systemd.

It looks like that my principle is not in line with Devuan. I was quite
pessimistic about Devuan after I found out that the principle of Devuan
is to provide freedom of choice which includes the choice to support
systemd. The sentence that I always remember is this one: [quote]*But if
you want a system designed to be unable to run systemd, please leave us.
This is not the place for such an anti-freedom POV.*[/quote], on
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150505.165244.78917113.en.html.

Someone kept confirming that Devuan will not support systemd. But it was
confirmed as well that the option for Devuan to support systemd is still
quite wide open if someone (I believe more accurate will be a company as
big as RedHat) is willing to put the efforts to do that. And that will
be accepted by Devuan as long as there is no hard dependency to all
other packages. I think this is what keeps Devuan hoping to get the
support on, so the option for that is kept opened even the chance is
very low. This only creates confusions to Devuan users as there does not
seem to be a clear direction where to go.

I hope I really misunderstood all of that because if that would be true,
I am quite sure people outside Devuan especially the systemd supporters
will be laughing out loud at Devuan.