IMHO, if an external program calls a systemd API, does it because want
that systemd does something.
Write 10-100-1000 systemd shims that don't do anything, simply returns
"true" is not a solution: in case, we have to "translate" the systemd
api call to the "real" daemon in execution and this could be an effort
bigger than evacuate systemd to 10.000 packages.


On 08/08/15 17:49, Mark S Bilk wrote:
> It seems to me that it's good to have shim programs that satisfy
> dependencies of apps on systemd, each shim performing some systemd
> function. Here's why:
>
> Suppose there are 10,000 application programs (apps) for Linux,
> and their developers foolishly insert dependencies on systemd.
>
> If Devuan developers write 50 simple shims to fulfill those
> dependencies, then Devuan users can run those 10,000 apps
> as they are, directly from the Debian repos. And when the
> apps are updated, they will still run. The Devuan devs
> don't have to deal with those 10,000 updates at all. And
> the shim programs only have to be updated when the systemd
> API that they are emulating changes.
>
> Now suppose that systemd shims are not used. That means that
> all 10,000 apps have to be patched by Devuan developers so they
> don't depend on systemd. And all the 10,000 patched apps have to
> sit in a Devuan repo that has to be maintained. And every time one
> of those 10,000 apps is updated, the Devuan devs have to repatch
> it to remove the systemd dependencies and recompile it. The
> Devuan devs can request the app devs to remove the systemd
> dependencies, but that has a low probability of success,
> because the app devs have lemming-consciousness rather than
> Unix-consciousness, and think that systemd is fine because
> the major distros have adopted it.
>
> So using a relatively small number of shim programs in Devuan
> will save an enormous amount of work for the Devuan developers,
> which will allow them to use their time for more productive
> purposes -- making Devuan more generally useful and attractive,
> thereby gaining far more users.
>
> Now I realize that the idea of having those shim programs is
> going to make some Devuan people scream, "Unclean! Unclean!".
> But the shim programs will be under our control and will
> save us a huge amount of constantly ongoing work of updating
> apps. And Devuan will succeed with only 25 developers and
> administrators instead of needing 500.
>
> So please drop the fear of contamination, and consider the
> shims as a simple, inexpensive and effective wall of defense
> against systemd.
>

>    Mark

>
> _______________________________________________
> Dng mailing list
> Dng@???
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng