On Wed, Jul 22, 2015 at 11:50:44AM -0400, Jude Nelson wrote:
> >
> >
> > If I was able to understand correctly, vdev works with dbus.
>
>
> Vdev does not use dbus. No idea how or why you came to this conclusion.
> Search the code if you don't believe me.
>
> -Jude
I believe you. You never appeared dishonest to me. And I'm very glad
that I was wrong!

Whence I derived that wrong understanding? From having misundestood
something with the little time that I dedicated to reading about vdev
from the list or elsewhere. Sorry!

But Im very glad that I was wrong in that conjecture! Because that means
my dream may be feasible when vdev is ready for deployment!

Regarding Thorsten Glaser <tg@???>, I got it from reading
discussions on debian-devel list, e.g.:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2014/07/msg00015.html

How to avoid stealth installation of systemd?
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=116770&start=30#p552484

I got a "550 Unrouteable address" for it, as visibale in the attachment
(mirabilos-unroutable.eml). So don't know.

Really my dream a true foss Devuan. Cheers!
--
Miroslav Rovis
Zagreb, Croatia
http://www.CroatiaFidelis.hr
From @ Wed Jul 22 17:08:19 2015

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From: miro.rovis@???
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Subject: Will there be a MirDevuan "WTF"?
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Hi, Devuaners!

I wrote to this list before, a couple of times. As
miro.rovis@??? and miroslav.rovis1@???.

I'll start from here:

How to avoid stealth installation of systemd?
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3D20&t=3D116770&start=3D45#p552566
(
the encrypted channel not set up by user in every box with dbus; and give me
someone the reason that I ask there: "a completely truthful explanation[...=
],
publically, on why is this needed"
)

which is, in that long, and well read, counter-systemd article of mine in t=
he
form of a forum topic, a section about dbus.

I don't want dbus, and lots of other things, in my system.

Lots of things like someone much cleverer than me, in terms of computing, a
Debian developer, and the leader of MirBSD, advocates (and to whom a Cc:
goes), like he advocates against, in most practical terms, on the:

MirDebian "WTF" Repository
https://www.mirbsd.org/~tg/Debs/debidx.htm

I count dbus in poetterware-related, as it is a ware for the non-FOSS to dig
its tentacles deep into your systems, such as in the hooks prepared for them
by, among others, Linus himself.

[my title to it:] rootkit hooks in the kernel
http://www.crmbuyer.com/story/39565.html

and also see this non-exhaustive, practical list of widely used spy-tools, a
list practically compiled by true security experts, published so users can
learn to defend themselves):

Grsecurity/Appendix/Capability Names and Descriptions
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Grsecurity/Appendix/Capability_Names_and_Desc=
riptions

Having a system without systemd like Devuan already is, is great, but is no=
t a
complete solution for developing a free unsurveilled system if you keep dbus
in it. Not in my book! And not in many others' book.

My insisting on no-dbus has been looked favorably by wizards in Gentoo:

Uninstalling dbus adn *kits (to Unfacilitate Remote Seats)
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-992146.html

=2E I have, as far as a user lacking in really advanced expertize can do, an
almost perfectly sustainable system that is not easily intruded in, that do=
es
not get owned any more, and pranks on my Gentoo system are pretty much redu=
ced
to the outside only. And the same is attainable for any Gentoo user, because
Gentoo wizards care to make Gentoo packages available for dbus-free systems
like mine. As far as my user understanding goes, it's devs who are making it
happen.

Back to MirDebianWTF repo. I was, applying mirabilos' work on my sysvinit- =
and
non-systemd Debian, [I was] able to get a poetterware-free Debian back then:

Remove Systemd and Related Packages from Your Debian
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3D16&t=3D118197
(see the dates there)

Now...

If I was able to understand correctly, vdev works with dbus. Jude C. Nelson,
why are you basing it on such a corporate-intrusion-enabling software (or
harvesting/other-nefarious-purposes enabling software)? I remember having
read from you back quite a few months ago various articles when I was outra=
ged
at systemd imposition and was researching about it. I wouldn't have expected
you to not realize that dbus was a false-foss program... false for the true
sense of the nature of FOSS. But, maybe there's nothing to do now, I don't
know. I know I won't be using anything that requires dbus...

There was some talk of eudev on devuan mailing list, and people began to
implement it. Where is that now?

A digression. I follow mostly only Devuan mailing list, as best I can. I'm =
not
privy to all that is happening in Devuan... Shouldn't there anyway be a
central place from where to know without searching what and in which section
has been done and at what stage this or that is... Like a page to start when
you want to know the status and the news, a page always sensibly up to date=
=2E..

[A digression. I follow mostly only Devuan mailing list, as best I can], and
if I missed something, be kind to correct me.

So eudev not planned?

Just to point you at something that sparks my enthusiasm, as a keen support=
er.
and fills me with some angst at the same time. What it those f**ing tool(s)
(as Christopher Barry,
http://lkml.org/lkml/2014/8/12/459
, who I see also follows, if not contributes, to Devuan, as he called
Poettering)... [What if those tools] achieve, for their masters, their
nefarious purposes sooner then true FOSS devs can raise defences against su=
ch
threats?

plans when udev becomes systemd-only ? (after kdbus merge)
https://github.com/gentoo/eudev/issues/95#issuecomment-122873308

And eudev works dbus-free just fine (such as in my Gentoo), dear people!

So, maybe to cut the talking shorter:

Is no-poetterware, no-dbus Devuan soon to be an attainable option for a user
like me, of medium advanced level (my maximum attainable level probably a g=
ood
tester)?

And then in no-dbus no-poetterware Devuan I apply grsec, and teach newbies =
to
install grsec-hardened kernels in their Devuans, like I did in Debian Forum=
s:

Grsecurity/Pax installation on Debian GNU/Linux
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3D16&t=3D108616

And to you, mirabilos, a question. What does this Devuan now beta (IIUC) lo=
ok
like to you? Can your MirDebianWTF fork into MirDevuanWTF and apply?

That is my dream!

Regards!

--=20
Miroslav Rovis
Zagreb, Croatia
http://www.CroatiaFidelis.hr

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