I agree T. J.

The problem is too much "thinking" about problems, rather than offering a clear solution other than scrapping the fore and replacing it entirely seems to be the source of the problem.

One argument I stand by adamantly is that while sysvinit was imperfect in design, it left room to allow the tree to branch in various ways with the applied tools. OpenRC is a prime example of taking sysvinit and expanding upon it in a way that allows for diversity just like daemontools, bsd-style scripting, and other service supervisors do brilliantly. Sysvinit doesn't have to be the workhorse, but it can be the harness providing the standard functions of startup and shutdown for the workhorse of your choosing.

However few people are willing to step outside their boxes and look for ways to improve systems without resulting to rampant progressivism with new software than isn't even finished in it's goals.

In the late 90s Dan Bernstein's daemontools could have ended the overreliance on sysvinit, but few embraced it.

Now we see the rush to "do" when something comes along to create a rift. No ill will to anyone, but if anyone had have "done" years ago, there might be less a need to "do" now.

Sent from my Windows Phone
________________________________
From: T.J. Duchene<mailto:t.j.duchene@gmail.com>
Sent: ‎5/‎13/‎2015 8:27 PM
To: dng@???<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org>
Subject: Re: [Dng] Systemd discussions at LinuxQuestions.





Unfortunately this seems to be a growing trend following the Microsoft playbook of acquisition, suppression, and extinction on various Linux communities and mailing lists I've been privy to as of recent.

Fewer and fewer distributions have avoided systemd but discussion into alternatives is growingly met with hostilities. ArchLinux took a severe hardline approach and rampantly banned any anti-systemd topics and users as well as anyone offering alternatives. While LQ has been trying to maintain neutrality as a position, growing numbers of systemd fanboys who immediately attack and troll people just to get them hushed or banned is climbing.



In advance, I just want to say that what I am about to say is my own opinion and in no way reflects or represents anyone else.



Put politely as possible: “Stuff them.”



I do not think that this is any one person, community or agenda. The Linux community for the most part has been dominated by communities beholden to a particular version of Linux and never to Linux as a whole. This encourages “group think.” Once you get them fixated on anything – it does not have to be systemd – it could be package format or filesystem, everyone else is wrong and they are right. It does not matter what the reasons are. Almost all individual impulse is subsumed. When someone objects, for example Ian Jackson over at Debian, the community becomes so hostile that they leave.



I just use the code. That is the whole point of opensource, and if people do not like my opinions then so be it. I seldom participate in Linux communities outside of developer discussions or help topics. Devuan is an exception. I came back, because for some reason I am genuinely curious about what goes on here. In the main, it is my opinion that the entire community is just too toxic. Just like politics, people have become intolerant beyond reason. I try very hard to be reasonable, but I frown on Linux these days.

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