Minor correction: I should point out that Linus was mad at Kay Sievers for
breaking udev, and then blaming the kernel's firmware loader. The breakage
didn't have anything to do with kdbus, as far as I know (which is what I
was trying to clarify in the first place--Linus and Kay weren't fighting
about anything related to kdbus or systemd integration).

-Jude

On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 2:19 AM, hellekin <hellekin@???> wrote:

> # Devuan Weekly News Issue XIV
>
> __Volume 002, Week 9, Devuan Week 14__
>
> Released 03/03/12015 [HE](why-he)
>
>
> https://git.devuan.org/Envite/devuan-weekly-news/wikis/past-issues/volume-02/issue-014
>
> ## Editorial
>
> It's hard to believe it's winter when you have to mop the sweat out of
> your keyboard, but the intensity of this week's conversations, and
> @golinux's [penguins][0] made thinking about cold easier. Cold reigns
> in deep space as well and Devuan users will appreciate the identity
> moving away from toyland: although Debian Jessie refers to an
> adventurous toy cowgirl with an attitude, Devuan's Jessie refers to a
> place no toy has ever gone before. Exit the naughty `Sid` brat,
> welcome `Ceres`, largest object in the asteroid belt, and the first
> minor planet discovered in the 19th Century. That's right, [Devuan
> release codenames][1] will be named after minor planets of our solar
> system. As far as visual identity goes, and although the logo still
> consumes a significant bit of attention, it won't be revealed before
> the code: part of the distro's publishing policy is to deliver working
> code before a shiny image. Welcome to Issue XIV of the DWN, cooked
> _al dente_ by your interim editor, @hellekin, with the invaluable help
> of @golinux and @joerg_rw.
>
> ## Last Week in Devuan
>
> ### [Debian Problems with Jessie][2]
>
> T.J.Duchene advises not to bring "Debian mud" to the list: "Devuan
> does not need to justify its own existence." Here comes the largest
> thread this week: a swashbuckling introspective and speculative bubble
> visiting what's wrong with collective creation of software. (It all
> started with _Simple Backgrounds_, go figure.)
>
> ### [Three Important UI Features][3]
>
> Last week Jonathan Wilkes introduced the idea of improving the
> features for the default devuan desktop. Wolfgang Pirker proposes two
> solutions for the "find apps as you type" #2 feature. Feature #3
> "menu on the Super key" can be addressed with `dmenu`. A consensual
> voice raises in favor of Xfce as the default desktop environment (DE),
> which comes with its own implementation equivalent to what dmenu
> provides.
>
> In passing, for your hacker jeopardy, here's a funky compiler flag in
> `Enlightenment` that will probably break the layout of many screen
> applications displaying this:
>
> `--enable-i-really-know-what-i-am-doing-and-that-this-will-probably-break-things-and-i-will-fix-them-myself-and-send-patches-aba`.
>
> ### [Xfce Desktop Environment in Devuan][4]
>
> As `Xfce 4.12` was released this week on the 28th of February, it was
> also chosen to become the default DE in Devuan, which makes it the
> first _non-systemd_ difference between cowgirl Jessie and planet
> Jessie. David Harrison talked with the Xfce team, and @jaromil
> confirms existing coordination and good terms between Devuan and Xfce.
>
> ### [Logind Alternative][5]
>
> Oz Tiram introduces the `ConsoleKit2` fork that does not depend on
> `systemd-logind`. Svante Signell offers to package it for Devuan.
> Dima Krasner reminds that "ConsoleKit2 was already packaged by Max,
> but we don't need it in the Jessie cycle because the logind dependency
> was dropped from all packages."
>
> ### [Simple Backgrounds][6]
>
> Hendrik Boom is concerned not to delay the first release for designing
> the project's visual identity (and he's right). As @jaromil puts it:
> "Devuan is sugar-free and doesn't makes your computer fat :^)" See the
>
>
> editorial.
>
> ### More of Devuan Logo
>
> Discussions abound regarding the potential Devuan logo. Linuxito
> announces a [graphical version of the survey][7], warning that it's
> informative, and Anto notes that a logo without matching text "would
> look strange". In [another thread][8], Hendrik Boom suggests using
> the Milky Way as the basis for the logo (that was before the release
> code names were announced, but it was in the air). Tzu-Pei Chen shows
> that a single-arm spiral galaxy exists, which Hendrik qualifies as
> "debian galaxy", leaving the interpretation of the comment's depth to
> the astute reader. Neo Futur engages in the [philosophy of KISS][9].
>
> ### The Valentine <3 Pre-Release Support
>
> More people come with feedback over the Valentine Pre-Release ISO.
> Please [report any issue][10] with this release so the team can ensure
>
>
> these are gone in the next batch. John Morris reports [quite a few
> issues][11], some of them coming from Debian Installer itself. His
> verdict: "most problems were fixable and process 1 is init
> so.... Winning!"
>
> Hendrik Boom plans [to install Valentine pre-alpha on real
> hardware][12]. So far he got the hardware to boot from USB using the
> `isohybrid` method as `dd` would not work, but got stuck with manual
> partitioning: the disk seems not to offer a safe option to [preserve
> existing partitions][13]. He also mentions a long-standing but minor
> bug in debootstrap that prevents Debian from offering multiple inits.
> Svante Signell narrows down the issue to Debian bug #668001, and a
> maintainer refusing to include the patch in Jessie. Hint: that patch
> _will_ be in Devuan Jessie. Hendrik also had issues with
> partitioning, and suspicions rose against systemd inside the
> installer. Paranoia? Adam Borowski suspects something else went
> wrong as he was able to use existing partitions like in Wheezy.
> Richard and Hendrik promise to investigate further.
>
> In the end, we've seen our [first community support request][14]
> fulfilled. Congratulations Steve Litt for asking, and Gravis for
> solving!
>
> ### [Looking for advices in preparation to switch from Debian to
> Devuan][15]
>
> Anto follows up on last week's VPS experiment to run Debian
> Wheezy/Jessie without systemd appearing in the logs, in preparation of
> switching to Devuan...
>
> ### [What if systemd infects the kernel?][16]
>
> @golinux smells the elephant in the room. Jude claims it's unlikely,
> and that Kay Sievers' `kdbus` code was rejected because he didn't use
> the documented interface to request a firmware driver, causing `udev`
> to hang. BTW, `dbus` and `kdbus` only share 4 letters of their name.
>
> ### [Circumvention Tech Festival][17]
>
> Influenced by his presence at the [CTF][18], our dear
> editor-in-chief @envite asks: "can Devuan be a security and
> privacy-aware distro"? @jaromil dares "to say that Devuan is more
> security-aware than Debian". He goes on to explain why, and mentions
> in passing "doing our best to contain the attitude of GNOME and other
> DE developments which are spawning daemons like there is no tomorrow".
>
> ### [Easy Forkability][19]
>
> A follow-up on the question: "Are there aspects of the existing
> structure of Debian that made it more difficult to fork?", where
> design-by-committee meets the wisdom-of-crowds. Indeed, in an
> adhocracy, communication is key. Or as Hendrik puts it "The
> interaction structure of the crowd is a key element."
>
> ### Devuan Documentation
>
> Beginning of [Devuan Dmenu Howto][20], by Steve Litt who inaugurates
> the [Devuan documentation][21] group and project.
>
> ### [Disnovation][22]
> @jaromil introduces a blog from Regine Debatty about "disnovation: an
> inquiry into the mechanics and rethoric of innovation".
> P. T. Zoltowski remarks that "if you see an analogy with some init
> system here, it's because there's one!", claiming that nature uses DNA
> replication where the fascist mind replaces the worse-old with the
> better-new. Martijn Dekkers slips in some illustration of iDeal
> addiction. Bottom line: "the more diversity the better, for everyone".
>
> ### [Combatting Revisionist History][23]
>
> @golinux describes an "excellent analysis of the systemd debacle" and
> a "required reading". So we won't spoil it. Nevertheless,
> T.J. Duchene promptly reacted to "respectfully disagree", claiming
> "the analysis to be very biased". Steve Litt responds by saying that
> "the vast majority of this mailing list, whose project was created in
> order to choose one's init system without trashing the entire OS"
> shares the author's bias. Neo Futur agrees that systemd "does so much
> more than just the init system", leading the GNU/Linux OS to turn into
> "a redhat-glibc-systemd-linux". An interesting discussion to wrap
> one's mind around features that systemd brings, that could be useful
> to implement in a modular way to "perform the same task without
> becoming The Blob." (Gravis)
>
> ### [free and open world][24]
>
> Hendrik Bloom invites to discuss Clarke's remark of last week: "I
> imagine there will be a lot of back and forth sharing as time goes on
> that is the nature of the free and open world."
>
> One remark: when you say "free and open", can you imagine saying "free
> and close" (sounds like a date), or "prisoner and open"? (Call
> Torquemada!)
>
> ### [Beware The Red Hat Octopus][25]
>
> Steven W. Scott warns against Red Hat's way, comparing systemd with
> Microsoft's failed attempt to supplant Sun's Java. (Is there a Godwin
> point for mentioning M$?) He offers to chainsaw the octopus'
> tentacles.
>
> ### [Why is there only one dbus?][26]
>
> Godefridus Daalmans asks in a self-confessed long email (but full of
> interesting thoughts). Nate Bargmann replies shortly, distilling some
> mostly *NIX wisdom: "Most likely because it has mostly been restrained
> to its problem domain and no one has been troubled enough by it to
> reimplement a replacement." Jude Nelson suggests that if
> "inter-process communication could be done all over again from
> scratch" it would probably take the form of userspace API filesystems.
>
> ## Missing Bits
>
> As the activity on the list intensified and the topics covered
> diversified, we decided to keep some out of the Weekly News. Here's
> what we've skipped that you may want to check for yourself:
>
> + [Troubleshooting][27]
> + [KDE systemd lock-in][28]
> + [A New Video and Text I came across][29]
> + [wicd & wpasupplicant][30]
> + [btrfs works fine, Lennart has no idea what he is talking about][31]
> + [Init Freedom Badges][32]
>
> ## Devuan's Not Gnome
>
> DNG is the discussion list of the Devuan Project.
>
> - [Subscribe to the list][subscribe]
> - [Read online archives][archives]
>
> -------------------
> Read you next week!
>
> Devuan Weekly News is made by your peers: you're [welcome to
> contribute][wiki]!
>
> + @envite (editor at large)
> + @hellekin (interim editor)
> + @golinux (word wrangler)
> + Joerg @joerg_rw Reisenweber (document scrutinizer)
>
> [0]: http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/penguins/trio.png "@golinux penguins"
> [1]: https://git.devuan.org/devuan/devuan-project/wikis/devuan-codenames
> "Devuan release codenames"
> [2]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150227.201815.f934f01f.en.html
> "Debian Problems with Jessie"
> [3]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.133648.c5d53629.en.html
> "three important UI features"
> [4]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.195105.abb6d702.en.html
> "Xfce response"
> [5]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.214900.48c9d626.en.html
> "Logind alternative (spolier: Consolekit fork)"
> [6]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150226.170458.4ac4785c.en.html
> "Simple Backgrounds"
> [7]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150225.161041.bfc73c54.en.html
> "Devuan Logo Survey"
> [8]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.122839.72ac21cc.en.html
> "logo again"
> [9]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.084456.df74b744.en.html
> "[philosophy] KISS, roots linux and the logo"
> [10]: https://git.devuan.org/devuan/devuan-project/issues "Issue tracker
> for Datalove Pre-Release milestone"
> [11]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150226.030100.3b4989f9.en.html
> "Kicking the tires on Valentine release"
> [12]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150223.212412.c6bb71b4.en.html
> "plan to install valentine pre-alpha on real hardware."
> [13]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150301.174447.e291a4c2.en.html
> "No way to use a prepartioned disk?"
> [14]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150301.163821.c9b5b507.en.html
> "Us as tech support"
> [15]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150301.084714.4512f741.en.html
> "Looking for advices in preparation to switch from Debian to Devuan"
> [16]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150228.070546.023c236c.en.html
> "What if systemd infects the kernel?"
> [17]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150301.182010.e5ddfe3b.en.html
> "Circumvention Tech Festival"
> [18]: https://openitp.org/festival/about.html "CTF website"
> [19]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150227.190517.6001e8e9.en.html
> "Easy Forkability"
> [20]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150302.050744.48e28d7c.en.html
> "Beginning of Devuan Dmenu Howto"
> [21]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150301.222647.fc2b8558.en.html
> "Doc Devuan"
> [22]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150228.104616.6b097a4d.en.html
> "Disnovation: an inquiry into the mechanics and rhetoric of innovation"
> [23]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150225.211109.1a574293.en.html
> "Combatting revisionist history"
> [24]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150218.143334.5a1bfc70.en.html
> "free and open world"
> [25]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.233014.d436be37.en.html
> "without-systemd"
> [26]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150225.160242.f0adbafc.en.html
> "idea for discussion: why 1 dbus [long e-mail]"
> [27]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150223.224634.898ad466.en.html
> "It may be only one file, but it does point to the bigger problem!"
> [28]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.141634.914d557e.en.html
> "KDE systemd lock-in"
> [29]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150226.034512.35133b4e.en.html
> "A New Video and Text I came across."
> [30]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150224.203530.87e75a06.en.html
> "wicd & wpasupplicant"
> [31]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150227.161511.cb3a7c50.en.html
> "btrfs repair works fine, Lennart has no idea what he is talking about -
> was OT - It may be only one file, but it does point to the bigger problem!"
> [32]:
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20150227.192106.bb8ec903.en.html
> "Init Freedom Badges"
>
>
> [subscribe]: https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
> "Subscribe to DNG"
> [archives]: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/list/dng.en.html "Read DNG
> List Archive"
> [upcoming]:
> https://git.devuan.org/Envite/devuan-weekly-news/wikis/upcoming-issue
> "Upcoming Issue"
> [wiki]: https://git.devuan.org/Envite/devuan-weekly-news/wikis/home
> "Devuan Weekly News"
> [why-he]: https://git.devuan.org/Envite/devuan-weekly-news/wikis/Why-HE
>
>

> --
>  _ _     We are free to share code and we code to share freedom
> (_X_)yne Foundation, Free Culture Foundry * https://www.dyne.org/donate/
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