>     joerg i share your sentiment. 

>     For the secrets and lies, my PGP key:
>     https://libbitcoin.dyne.org/julia_tourianski.pgp.asc

>     On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 3:36 PM, Joerg Platzer <joerg@???
>     <mailto:joerg@room77.de>> wrote:

>         Now have I entirely missed something here or do you guys keep
>         on discussing if it was cool that DPR ordered murders for hire
>         even though he is neither charged with these crimes not to
>         mention found guilty?

>         This reminds me of when the whole world discussed if it was ok
>         for Sadam Hussein to have nuclear weapons or not, thus giving
>         credibility to the outright lies of the people who claimed he
>         had them.

>         The same government-bag full of liars who claim that DPR
>         wanted to kill by the way.

>         ++jp

>         ________________________________________
>         Von: unSYSTEM <unsystem-bounces@???
>         <mailto:unsystem-bounces@lists.dyne.org>> im Auftrag von Seth
>         <list@??? <mailto:list@sysfu.com>>
>         Gesendet: Montag, 9. Februar 2015 06:26
>         An: System undo crew
>         Betreff: Re: [unSYSTEM] Silk Road Trial is starting.

>         On Fri, 06 Feb 2015 21:14:00 -0800, Alec Spier
>         <alec.spier@??? <mailto:alec.spier@consultant.com>>
>         wrote:

>         > What were the terrible choices he had to face?
>         >
>         > A: Be blackmailed and pay the blackmail, close up shop and
>         leave with
>         > deca-deca-millions.
>         > Improve security and open another store.

>         >
>         > B: Pay the blackmail and stay open. Be blackmailed again
>         potentially.

>         >
>         > C: Tell the guy to fuck off, close shop and leave with your
>         > deca-deca-millions.

>         >
>         > D: Tell the guy to fuck off, keep shop open risk him
>         releasing the
>         > customer
>         > lists and allow the customers to be responsible for their
>         own actions of
>         > giving
>         > their addresses and names to anonymous people on the internet.

>         >
>         > E: CLOSE SHOP, LAY LOW, MAKE A NEW WEBSITE

>         >
>         > F (for FAIL): Have a man whose identity you are not even
>         definitively
>         > sure of (considering
>         > he didn't end up being existent) murdered...along with
>         anybody else
>         > threatening
>         > your clientele.

>         >
>         > Just about every other option could have had him not cross
>         the line and
>         > attempt
>         > to pay for people to DIE. Sorry but there's not any clear
>         excuse for
>         > this action
>         > in my eyes, if you can explain one to me I'm willing to listen.

>         See the problem here is that it was the blackmailer/snitch who
>         first
>         threatened violence, in this case the violence of the state.
>         And it wasn't
>         just DPR that was going to be harmed, it was many other
>         innocent people
>         that did not aggress against anyone else.

>         Sicking the state on someone means threats backed by deadly
>         force. The
>         state gunmen threaten and/or inflict increasing levels of
>         aggressive
>         violence against a person until they either submit or die.
>         State agents
>         call this the 'use of force continuum'.

>         In cases where the person on the receiving end of this
>         violence is an
>         actual criminal (that is caused real harm to person or
>         property) this is
>         not always a bad thing. In every other case it is.

>         Get in this cage, or get in this body bag, it's your choice.

>         So the snitch really was threatening all kinds of people with
>         deadly
>         force, and many of those people were going to have their lives
>         destroyed
>         by the state. Some would most likely be raped in prison as a
>         result, which
>         one could argue is a fate worse than death.

>         Now for an extreme example of the concept: Let's say for the
>         sake of
>         argument that you are harboring a bunch of (insert persecuted
>         people) from
>         (insert despotic dictator) and his hired killers. Along comes
>         a person who
>         says, I'm a little short on cash, unless you provide me 300K
>         USD, I'm
>         going to let the dictator know where to find all these people
>         who are
>         cowering in your basement.

>         If you pay someone to kill the snitch, is that an immoral act?
>         _______________________________________________
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>         https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>         _______________________________________________
>         unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
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