On Fri, Dec 05, 2014 at 06:21:26PM +0100, Franco Lanza wrote:
> > On Fri, Dec 05, 2014 at 02:54:09PM +0200, Vlad wrote:
> > > I would propose that we do not waste any time with GDM, GNOME or
> > > anything else that has sprung out of that irresponsible organizations
> > > other than gtk.
> >
> > There's so much hate going on in within Devuan, it is rather ridiculous.
> > This is a public mailing list!
>
> Hello. this can be considered a sort of official answer by devuan.
>
> IN devuan there is NO hate. There is people around us that HATE both
> systemd and GNOME. WE DON'T. We just think the our direction isn't the
> same as the distro that adopt systemd, and we are working to remove it
> from debian to make our devuan.
>
> We will NOT use gnome as default CAUSE of systemd integration with
> gnome, but we WILL provide gnome and also at least some systemd
> components ( shim? logind? others? ) as OPTIONS to be used in case a
> user CHOOSE to use them and gnome.

I mainly wanted to make clear that it is possible to discuss. I'm
indifferent if that's taken up or not. If you want to offer GNOME
there's various options for the session support:
- shim (seems to still require logind)
- ConsoleKit (or the ConsoleKit2 fork)
+ then add back the suspend stuff and figure out UPower 1.0 situation

There's still ConsoleKit support, but not sure for how long that will be
kept. With shim and systembsd there might not be a real need for it
anymore as pretty much most will be using GNOME with those APIs.

For stuff like hostnamed and so on, just use the programs from systemd
IMO.

> IF we will have enough manpower and someone will want to work on patches
> and/or systemd components sobstitutes that are KISS and stand alone
> without systemd dependencies, like someone is now working on a logind
> sobstitute, we will use it instead of systemd things. If we will have
> patches, we will try to contribute also to gnome with them.

For getting patches upstream, best to normally talk to the maintainer of
the component you have a patch for. It's similar to the kernel, don't be
surprised if people disagree with a patch. I prefer if things use the
same API. For e.g. some bits, the maintainer is just not qualified to
maintain non-systemd. That's why I said in the initial message that it
probably needs a commitment.

> End of the story, no hate, just our goals can differ and we will do the
> best to offer all options we can to anyone.

Mailing list here sometimes gives a different impression. It's young and
I guess eventually when there's more progress to be seen people
hopefully be different.

--
Regards,
Olav