On 11/30/14 11:34 PM, Franco Lanza wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 01, 2014 at 12:22:08AM -0500, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>>> I confirm this. Our intention is to offer a distro where you
>>> can be totally systemd free. But there is NO point in deny it
>>> if someone want to use it, assuming this don't destroy the rest
>>> of the choices.
>>
>> Aye, but that's the rub. The systemd developers are doing
>> everything they can to force systemd on the rest of us - by
>> gobbling up functionality into a monolithic hairball, and
>> creating lots of dependencies.
>>
>> It sure looks like allowing it anywhere is almost a guarantee
>> that it will engulf and devour everywhere.
>
> Probably i'm not clear enough. This is the philosophy side: we give
> freedom even to eat shit if someone really like to.
>
> This is the reality side: we will give shit only if we can. If we
> can't, no shit, sorry.
>
> This mean that by principes we will try to let systemd be an
> option assuming that it can be done. If there is no way to have it
> as an option and you must choose "or systemd in whole system or no
> systemd", well, our choice will be no systemd.

There is no shame in not being the distro for everyone. That is the
freedom of Linux, you can chose which distro suits you best. There is
nothing wrong with the idea that if you want systemd, Debian is your
choice, not Devuan. By not supporting systemd at all, we are not
limiting anyone's freedom, there are many other distros that he/she
can run.

>
>> "a distro where you can be totally systemd free" and "if someone
>> want to use it, assuming this don't destroy the rest of the
>> choices"
>>
>> are fundamentally incompatible.
>
> Ok, assuming you right, we will try to be closer to it as
> feasible.
>
>
>> At the very least, what say we achieve the first, BEFORE, putting
>> any energy into the second.

The ideas of "do one thing and do it well" and the Unix way do not lend
themselves to the ideal of being the freest distro in the land. So
instead of just giving systemd the boot, Devuan will end up with a
half-assed version of systemd, just so it can claim to be super free.

A free distro is a great idea, but I need stability and a robust OS for
my servers. The great idea doesn't pay the bills.

Scott Blaydes

>
> The very first file of devuan is a pinning out of systemd-sysv at
> -1 level pinning. This should be an answer on this.
>
>
>
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Scott Blaydes
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