I would really that this bullshit against systemd-nosystemd will stop.
anyway:

On Mon, Dec 01, 2014 at 03:45:57AM +0000, Gregory Smith wrote:
>
> If you keep systemd then there is no point to this project.

False.
We are NOT against systemd. we are against HOW systemd is hijacking
the system, and against it forced to all by default.

Devuan will NOT force anyone to use it, and will keep the system usable
without systemd.

But this isn't meaning that if someone like to eat shit we must force it
to not to eat it.

> """
> As already known, we are NOT against systemd. We are pro-freedom.
> Systemd WILL BE supported in devuan. Just not in the same manner as it
> is in debian where it eat whole system.
> """

I confirm this.
Our intention is to offer a distro where you can be totally systemd
free.
But there is NO point in deny it if someone want to use it, assuming
this don't destroy the rest of the choices.

> Ugh. Subverted from the very start. Even includes the bullshit
> emphasis trying to beat down anyone who is against systemd.
> What kind of people is "we". This is the debian mailing list
> ALL (see I can do it too) over again. Disgusting and sad.
> I hope Mr. "We" is not actually a rep.

Mr. "we", me for istance, was exposing the view of "we" as VUA,
the group that started this fork.

> Sadly :(
> We don't get any choice. Even the "anti-systemd" fork
> is going with systemd. (As the above poster with his
> all caps emphasis showed: it would be crazy to think
> the fork against systemd would "NOT" include systemd.
> Crazy! You Fool! Get out!!)

If you are anti-systemd, you are welcome. With devuan you will be NOT
forced to use it. By default you will NOT have it installed at all.
You WILL have the choice to use it ONLY IN CASE YOU CHOOSE it.
And you will get it only in case that having it in the distro doesn't
conflict with other things and remain a configuration where you can
remove it safely without broke whole system.

> Disgusting and profoundly disappointing.
>
> People have given you money to have an old style linux
> without systemd. No systemd. Don't be soft and nice.

People are giving money to be free to choose whetever to use or not
systemd. To have the freedom to avoid it, and to don't have it imposed
by default. With devuan they will NOT forced to use it. If we can we will
grant the freedom even to use it, not by default anyway. But we will NOT
force anyone to have anything from it.


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Franco Lanza
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