"Democracy is the original 51% attack."

Not sure who said that (maybe evoorhees?), but it's one of the coolest
phrases I've ever heard. Seems to apply perfectly here.

Creating a system that won't be abused will probably turn out to be
quite difficult due to the changes in technology that happen over
time. the US Constitution was supposed to be a set of laws that cannot
be broken, a basic foundation, but it's still just a piece of paper
and people can "interpret" it however they please. It's possible that
we need to simply hit CTRL+ALT+DEL and kill all tasks on our consensus
operating system every few hundred years. We could set awesome
standards right now, but another group of people in the future may
interpret them the wrong way if we need to apply them to space travel.

Thanks for the links. I'll check them out.

- -@kyletorpey <http://twitter.com/kyletorpey>

On 10/07/2014 08:31 PM, Amir Taaki wrote:
> that's really cool, I had an interesting realisation about the
> consensus when talking with a friend (caedes) a few days ago.
> Basically democracy is the will of the majority whereas consensus
> is about agreement between everybody. If people disagree then it
> isn't consensus. Therefore it's important in our governance model
> that we are clear what purpose the consensus forming mechanisms
> serve such that they don't become abused (i.e like in our current
> 'democracies' where there's a lot of moralising at the expense of
> liberty), and that we strive for agreed compromise rather than rule
> by majority. I don't want to explain too much here but I think the
> goal of consensus should always be about maximising positive
> liberty: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_liberty
>
> Also check this:
>
> https://wiki.unsystem.net/index.php/UnSYSTEM/Opensource_city
>
> On 10/07/2014 08:16 PM, Kyle Torpey wrote:
>> Tried to write a basic outline for a new startup country a year
>> or two ago as a thought experiment. This ended up being the only
>> "tax" involved. Didn't know this was a real thing. I'll have to
>> find the old doc, but I think a yearly auction for the land tax
>> attached to each piece of land was involved. It's actually quite
>> similar to how a decentralized DNS should work.
>>
>> Not sure if there could be an issue with creating a "higher
>> class" of landowners vs everyone else, but it seems to be the
>> best way to handle land ownership.
>>
>> Josh's points on local ostracization are important when it comes
>> to dealing with people who break consensus. Although, I don't
>> think it would be incorrect to say that being on someone's else's
>> land without their permission is breaking the NAP.
>>
>> -@kyletorpey <http://twitter.com/kyletorpey>
>>
>> On 10/07/2014 01:22 PM, Josh Walker wrote:
>>>>
>>>> ​ Not sure how I feel about land tax, except that it seems
>>>> eminently
>>
>>> more logical than the other forms of tax.
>>>>
>>
>>> ​In my conversations with our like-minded brethren, I've found
>>> it's best understood when described as this:
>>
>>
>>> - ​It's not really a tax, because it's entirely optional --
>>> else it would violate the NAP. - ​ You ​are actually trading
>>> for community consensus that the property is *yours and yours
>>> alone. * *​*Therefore, you might say this is the cost of that
>>> service. - The cost is the equilibrium point ​at which you ​r
>>> desire to ​keep the property exceeds what someone ​someone else
>>> would offer.
>>
>>
>>> ​If you're actively listening, you might notice price discovery
>>> is the only tricky part here. This also isn't to replace the
>>> cost of selling developed property; this is just the cost of
>>> retaining consensus ownership of the underlying land.
>>
>>> If you are actively contributing the cost of consensus to the
>>> community in an acceptable form (I see no reason a community
>>> would always demand *only *raw currency, necessarily), the
>>> following happens.
>>
>>> - Someone disregarding the community consensus would face
>>> censure in all local markets. In almost all cases, knowledge of
>>> this alone is expected to keep folks in like. - If a squatter
>>> arrives and refuses to leave, and is not dissuaded by being
>>> unable to interact, buy, or sell with the community, you may
>>> remove the squatter. With the minimum force required, of
>>> course. This means, for example, you could physically push the
>>> squatter off the land, as gently as possible, and if the
>>> squatter escalated the altercation, the community would not
>>> view the squatter's escalation as an act of self-defense
>>> (unless you began with excessive force).
>>
>>> If you aren't contributing, it still isn't permissible for
>>> folks to come and steal or break things, but don't expect the
>>> community to object to a camper on your lawn using your well or
>>> something. (Local community standards will vary, I'm sure.) And
>>> as above, I'd definitely expect you to struggle to interact,
>>> buy, or sell with the local market.
>>
>>> The key being it's all voluntary and the only weapon is the
>>> *removal of consent to associate.* Also notable is, there's
>>> clearly room for compassion and exceptions, or for communities
>>> to accept payment in the way of labor, etc.
>>
>>> -J
>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 7, 2014 at 11:35 AM, Adam Gibson
>>> <ekaggata@???> wrote:
>>
>>> It's not quite the same. The blockchain is literally created
>>> by the miners (the part that actually is useful, the new
>>> blocks). The land was always there.
>>
>>> Not sure how I feel about land tax, except that it seems
>>> eminently more logical than the other forms of tax.
>>
>>> On 10/07/2014 07:19 PM, Thomas Hartman wrote:
>>>>>> In some sense, couldn't the same argument be made for
>>>>>> owning chunks of a blockchain, if bitcoin or something
>>>>>> like it becomes a natural monopoly on transactional
>>>>>> economic activity?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Force address registration on as many people as you can,
>>>>>> and then tax. Sometimes simple obvious plans work best.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 7, 2014 at 8:48 AM, Amir Taaki
>>>>>> <genjix@???> wrote:
>>>>>>> Geolibertarians hold that all natural resources – most
>>>>>>> importantly land – are common assets to which all
>>>>>>> individuals have an equal right to access; therefore,
>>>>>>> individuals must pay rent to the community if they
>>>>>>> claim land as their private property. Rent need not be
>>>>>>> paid for the mere use of land, but only for the right
>>>>>>> to exclude others from that land, and for the
>>>>>>> protection of one's title by government.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Geolibertarians view the Land Value Tax as a single tax
>>>>>>> to replace all other methods of taxation, which are
>>>>>>> deemed unjust violations of the non-aggression
>>>>>>> principle.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A land value tax (or site valuation tax) is a levy on
>>>>>>> the unimproved value of land only. A land value tax
>>>>>>> (LVT) is different from other property taxes, which are
>>>>>>> taxes on the whole value of real estate: the
>>>>>>> combination of land, buildings, and improvements to the
>>>>>>> site.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geolibertarianism
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_value_tax
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>
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