:: Re: [unSYSTEM] Cody Wilson
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著者: Jacob
日付:  
To: System undo crew
題目: Re: [unSYSTEM] Cody Wilson
Thank you)) these kinds of discussions depress me alot, now back to bitcoin


On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 9:42 AM, jamileh s.t. <xiaziyna@???>wrote:

> off topic; reported, blocked, banned
>
>
> On 19 March 2014 08:03, Jacob <jacobusbogers@???> wrote:
>
>> what has this to with bitcoin?
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 5:40 AM, Robert Jakob <rsjakob@???> wrote:
>>
>>> I see, you're right. Politically Catalonia would be a great place. If
>>> they can establish sovereignty from Spain, but that might get messy. I
>>> have a lot of research to do. Please let me know if I can help in any way.
>>> I have a background in electrical engineering and IT. I'm working on
>>> learning more programming. Physically I've done everything from fixing
>>> cars and machinery to carpentry and farming. As long as I don't get
>>> deported I'll go and help out.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 11:20 PM, Amir Taaki <genjix@???> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hey Robert, thanks for your message. About places: the advantage we have
>>>> in Catalonia is that we can work with local networks who have political
>>>> support and pools of human resources that we can use for support. So the
>>>> conflict is always there, but we aim to protect ourself.
>>>>
>>>> We are going to begin industrial fabrication around September, and right
>>>> now it's important that we're developing software tools. We're
>>>> evaluating economic plans and researching different communities so we
>>>> can establish a fair participatory contract (constitution).
>>>> http://rfc.zeromq.org/spec:22
>>>>
>>>> If you want to participate, it's still very early days. We welcome
>>>> people who have something to offer, to come live and work with us on
>>>> projects. If you're not sure about your skills, then it's better to
>>>> visit and see where or how you can participate. We've set a 1 year
>>>> timeframe before we begin anyway.
>>>>
>>>> Also it's important that we're visible and the places have easy access.
>>>> You can find many very nice but isolated places.
>>>>
>>>> On 19/03/14 05:11, Robert Jakob wrote:
>>>> > Amir,
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > You gave me quite a bit of homework. Sounds like we're pretty mush on
>>>> > the same page. I've been thinking a lot about the monarchy vs modern
>>>> > american democracy since we started talking about this and you're
>>>> right
>>>> > that the dichotomy is too simplistic. There isn't a clear better or
>>>> > worse, right or wrong, there really is no lesser of two evils. In
>>>> fact,
>>>> > I think the US government is just the corporatization of the monarchy.
>>>> > It's quite genius from their perspective, because Bush can start a
>>>> war
>>>> > then Obama can come in and say, "OK, things are going to be different.
>>>> > Don't blame me for the last presidents policies." He says, "Give me
>>>> > time, I'll fix the economy, close Guantanamo, end the wars, bring the
>>>> > troops home, etc..." He wins a Nobel prize for his progressive ideas.
>>>> > So time passes, things calm down, people are no longer organized, and
>>>> > you see the new guy's policies are just as bad and in most cases worse
>>>> > than the previous president. Now six years have gone by and all we
>>>> can
>>>> > do is hope the next one will be better. And so goes the cycle. Of
>>>> > course, Hilary Clinton will probably win the next election and we'll
>>>> be
>>>> > just as disappointed. Which is what happens with monarchies, but this
>>>> > is on a much smaller time frame. So you're probably right about
>>>> > starting a new community altogether.
>>>> >
>>>> > You weren't kidding when you said this is for me. I would definitely
>>>> be
>>>> > willing to help. If I may suggest a few places also, northern Oregon
>>>> > and the big island of Hawaii would be perfect places. They both have
>>>> > pretty cheap land, great climate, very rich soil, and plenty of rain.
>>>> I
>>>> > have thought a lot about geodesic dome structures for housing and
>>>> > aquaponic gardens for agriculture. You can do a mix of hydroponic,
>>>> > aquaponic, and traditional farming to ensure you're not vulnerable to
>>>> > drastic changes in climate and mineral deficiencies in the soil. The
>>>> > biggest factor would be the local government. If you make everything
>>>> > open source you might invite conflicts with big governments and
>>>> > corporations. If you're wanting to remain local and quiet like a
>>>> > commune, there probably won't be an issue. Oregon and Hawaii would
>>>> also
>>>> > be great because you can use solar for electricity and filter the rain
>>>> > water for all plumbing. I could go on and on...
>>>> >
>>>> > I would like to get more involved and I would be much better suited
>>>> for
>>>> > manual labor than academia. Who can I talk to about helping with
>>>> > development and brainstorming ideas?
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > -Robert
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 9:21 AM, Jacob <jacobusbogers@???
>>>> > <mailto:jacobusbogers@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >     Excellent, I think this idea was first proposed by Voltare
>>>> >     (voluntarism). but less the leaches who predate on the labour and/
>>>> >     or life of others.

>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >     On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 3:40 PM, Adam Gmail
>>>> >     <adamlevinemobile@??? <mailto:adamlevinemobile@gmail.com>>
>>>> wrote:

>>>> >
>>>> >         It's about the tribe, tools for location independent community
>>>> >         and collaboration mean local is a philosophical decision, you
>>>> >         have many locals to pick yours from and you can even pick
>>>> many.

>>>> >
>>>> >         Morality is rules based, rules are localized so participating
>>>> In
>>>> >         disparate communities just means voluntarily opting in to
>>>> >         multiple rule sets and moralities.

>>>> >
>>>> >         It is good to have options.

>>>> >
>>>> >         Sent from my iPad

>>>> >
>>>> >         On Mar 15, 2014, at 2:32 AM, "jamileh s.t."
>>>> >         <xiaziyna@??? <mailto:xiaziyna@googlemail.com>>
>>>> wrote:

>>>> >
>>>> >         > as humans evolved from we have developed very efficient
>>>> >         computational devices. the ability to think on a group level
>>>> is
>>>> >         not something that comes easy to us as traditionally we would
>>>> be
>>>> >         part of a small and local community. being accustomed to such
>>>> an
>>>> >         environment it became typical for us to evaluate right and
>>>> wrong
>>>> >         for a small community mostly composed of family. the
>>>> definition
>>>> >         of right and wrong being something biological, something like
>>>> >         "how can i preserve as many humans who are most closely
>>>> related
>>>> >         for as long as possible". we developed secondary systems for
>>>> the
>>>> >         prime directive "how can i improve living quality", "i feel
>>>> pain
>>>> >         when i touch fire", "i feel sadness when i lose a loved one".
>>>> we
>>>> >         are now at a point in history where we have veered
>>>> sufficiently
>>>> >         away from such basic needs and the ruleset does not completely
>>>> >         suffice, we must now think on a group level, we are not
>>>> >         concerned with death, we place emphasis on other needs.
>>>> >         >
>>>> >         > it's difficult to define what this new ruleset should be,
>>>> >         should we completely abandon our earlier genetic tools in
>>>> favour
>>>> >         of computational answers? i don't think so completely, i think
>>>> >         inherently those earlier systems lead to good outcomes and
>>>> fast
>>>> >         decisions. for example, before we developed the current eye,
>>>> we
>>>> >         had a more primitive eye system which saw at a much faster
>>>> rate,
>>>> >         but with alot poorer vision, you can imagine how this is good
>>>> in
>>>> >         certain situations and in the same way how our very rough
>>>> >         genetic tools allow us to get a "feel" of the situation. you
>>>> can
>>>> >         say why do we need to stick to this arbitrary ruleset whose
>>>> sole
>>>> >         purpose is to preserve humanity, when maybe we can have
>>>> another
>>>> >         ruleset that does the same thing, maybe we don't need to be
>>>> kind
>>>> >         to each other but we can still survive on medicine and live
>>>> for
>>>> >         a long time. our genetic programming does allow for this, our
>>>> >         genetic programming allows us the intellectual capacity to
>>>> >         overcome our genetic programming. i believe this i
>>>> >          s where we should use computational tools, we are beginning
>>>> to
>>>> >         connect the points that form the logistic map, the
>>>> consequences
>>>> >         of waste, the consequence of slavery, the consequences of
>>>> >         hoarding information, these are all consequences which take
>>>> >         effect over time, and now due to the rapid rate the world
>>>> moves
>>>> >         at, are taking place within our lifetimes. a caveman without
>>>> >         computer could not predict such outcomes, like when they
>>>> hunted
>>>> >         to extinction the megafauna or killed off the neanderthals.

>>>> >         >
>>>> >         > so maybe "right" and "wrong" are not the correct words, but
>>>> >         it's kind of recursive, they have come to embody our
>>>> instincts,
>>>> >         and are thus defined by our instincts.
>>>> >         > _______________________________________________
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>>>> >         >
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>>>> >
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>>>> >
>>>> >
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>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
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>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
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