Quick rant: Turing complete is such a red herring. Its neither sufficient
nor necessary to do all the great things you want to with ethereum. You
could modify Bitcoin to have a turing complete script language and it
wouldn't make any difference in expressivity, because of how you can't
refer to txouts in a transaction its still inadequate for implementing
smart contracts. And you could also have a beautiful statically typed
contract language, where mostly any useful contract would be expressible,
yet the scripts could be guaranteed to terminate (or at least produce
output ) and thus wouldn't be Turing complete.

So if it helps for marketing, sure. And Im not disagreeing with any design
decision of ethereum here. But turing complete is just technobabble in this
context, and is basically being used to mean anything more expressive than
Bitcoin.

Thanks for your attention!
On Feb 7, 2014 4:32 PM, "Manfred Karrer" <mk@???> wrote:

> Here is a good article from Vitalik as well:
>
> http://bitcoinmagazine.com/9671/ethereum-next-generation-cryptocurrency-decentralized-application-platform/
>
> Here he explained also the motivation to create Ethereum and the problems
> with the other crypto 2.0 projects (he was a bit involved with mastercoins
> and colored coins as well).
> There are also some good hi level images:
> Think of the early static webbrowser as BTC and as when webbrowser
> implemented javascript as Ethereum.
> A turing complete language opens up completely new possibilities, it make
> the technology generic and not only a feature set.
>
> But its not only that, there is much more interesting stuff there, its not
> just another alt coin, its a real improvement in many ways over BTC. Of
> course nobody knows if all will really work out, but the alpha testnet is
> already deployed...
>
>
>
> Am 07.02.2014 um 22:14 schrieb Ruben Brito <urbenz@???>:
>
> I think I will proceed with caution. I do trust Vitalik and Mihai. They
> are world-class thinkers and coders as many of you know. I just get
> concerned when people ask me questions and I can't quickly answer or get
> the answers I need.
>
> I know Mastercoin is still in development, but for some reason, that
> project makes a lot more sense to me. There is a slow roll out of features,
> but I see progress there.
>
> Thanks Manfred and Thomas for your insights.
>
> Ruben
>
> Freelance Writer for Bitcoin Magazine<http://bitcoinmagazine.com/author/ruben/>
> Portfolio <http://www.behance.net/urbenz>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 7, 2014 at 1:26 PM, Manfred Karrer <mk@???> wrote:
>
>> Yes I understand your scepticism, specially after all that hype with
>> crypo 2.0 projects which raised a lot of money even if they did not have
>> anything working... smelled always a bit like ponzi, or at least not very
>> responsible attitude...
>>
>> The main reason why I see Ethereum different is because of Vitalik
>> Buterin.
>> He is a very special and very smart person with really high reputation. I
>> simply trust him.
>> The goal of the project is pretty high (use a turing complete script
>> language - Satoshi was not willing to take that risk) and I would not trust
>> other random devs to get that really going.
>>
>> But best is for sure to read as much of the information out there (and
>> dont get disturbed by bitcointalk/reddit noise).
>> To invest in such projects is for sure high risk, but the project itself
>> has so much other interesting potentials, that talking too much about the
>> IPO/investment is kind of boring. People who want to invest need to inform
>> themself well.
>> Others should see it as a project which could cause a lot of change.
>> Specially in the political and social sense it could bring us a new
>> culture of decentralisation (decentralized, dropbox, facebook, liquid
>> democracy, voting systems, reputation systems, DAO, ....).
>> Ethereum will not be used as money in the first place but rather serves
>> as the operating system where apps or other crypto currencies/financial
>> products will be executed.
>>
>> br,
>> manfred
>>
>>
>> Am 07.02.2014 um 18:59 schrieb Thomas Hartman <thomas@???
>> >:
>>
>> > It's almost impossible to know what's going on behind the scenes.
>> >
>> > My recommendation for ethereum is read the whitepaper and the
>> > bitcointalk threads, try to get some understanding of the technology
>> > involved, and decide if a) it will be used b) do altcoin investors
>> > THINK it could be used, meaning it jumps at the ipo.
>> >
>> > Frankly all the bitcoin 2.0 stuff (distributed exchange) is highly
>> > speculative. There are something like 5 well funded projects pursuing
>> > this, including ripple, and in my mind they could all fail. If one
>> > succeeds though, the coin backing it will appreciate hugely. IF.
>> >
>> > So, try to understand the technology, and then if you are semi
>> > convinced (because you will never be more than semi) invest
>> > conservatively. Cynicism is bad for software development, but it's
>> > good for investing, especially investing in something as speculative
>> > as bitcoin 2.0/ethereum/whatevercoin.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Fri, Feb 7, 2014 at 9:01 AM, Ruben Brito <urbenz@???> wrote:
>> >> I have a question about Ethereum. I love the project, but I don't know
>> >> enough about it.
>> >>
>> >> 1) Who is on the board for Ethereum? Someone has told me there is a
>> former
>> >> Goldman Sachs employee on there, but I didn't see a board listed on the
>> >> website as of a week or two ago. I did hear Goldman and Sachs
>> referenced in
>> >> the video.
>> >>
>> >> 2) How much ether is premined? I know it's nowhere near 50%, and when I
>> >> asked Vitalik he said some was premined, but didn't give a percentage.
>> >>
>> >> Ruben
>> >>
>> >> Freelance Writer for Bitcoin Magazine
>> >> Portfolio
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Feb 7, 2014 at 10:27 AM, Manfred Karrer <mk@???> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Ah great to hear that! 16.2. sounds good, will pass by with 2 friends
>> >>> probably.
>> >>> Cu then,
>> >>> Manfred
>> >>>
>> >>> Am 07.02.2014 um 16:10 schrieb Amir Taaki <genjix@???>:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Yes we're here working now. Feel free to drop in anytime. We have a
>> guy
>> >>>> working on a Bitcoin hardware project visiting us on Sunday, and the
>> >>>> local BTC community visiting on 16th.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 07/02/14 14:59, Manfred Karrer wrote:
>> >>>>> Hi guys,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I live in Barcelona and would love to get a Ethereum Meetup
>> organized
>> >>>>> here.
>> >>>>> Does anyone has some contacts to other Ethereum or BTC people in
>> >>>>> Barcelona or around BCN?
>> >>>>> I know there was a strong hub in Calafou last year, but I dont know
>> if
>> >>>>> there are still Bitcoiners over there.
>> >>>>> Any help is highly appreciated.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Thanks,
>> >>>>> Manfred
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> >>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> >>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> >>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> >> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>> >>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>
>