I think the message is loud and clear. And I completely agree with the
message. My point was the people who believe in that message don't need to
hitting the middle of the bullseye. I just feel that's selling the project
> i mean to emphasize that the message is the most important part, and is as
> was stated
>
>
> On 1 November 2013 15:20, Jason King <beinghomelessisnotacrime@???>wrote:
>
>> Cool, that is exactly the message that was broadcast.
>> On Nov 1, 2013 10:14 AM, "jamileh s.t." <xiaziyna@???> wrote:
>>
>>> i don't think the presentation of ideas or political ideals was at all
>>> extreme. its far more important that the cypherpunks have strong wires
>>> between themselves. people should really be funding is those ideals, the
>>> software is just computational crutches for implementation of ideals.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1 November 2013 15:00, Elizabeth Ploshay <
>>> elizabeth@???> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Jason and Vitalik,
>>>>
>>>> Great points there. I definitely appreciate this project and there is
>>>> much the Foundation must learn.
>>>>
>>>> I look forward to working with Vitalik to do a BM article.
>>>>
>>>> Additionally, keep up the good work on the foundation forum. IMO the
>>>> goal should be to continue to spread the truth before burning bridges.
>>>>
>>>> -Elizabeth
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 1, 2013, at 10:51 AM, Vitalik Buterin <vbuterin@???>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thank you Jason, very solid argument. I'm not in favor of burning
>>>> bridges myself; there are many great people in the foundation (eg.
>>>> Elizabeth for one, and even Jon Matonis has publicly written articles
>>>> praising System D on numerous occasions), and we should work with them to
>>>> make the foundation better. I looked at the Dark Wallet thread inside the
>>>> foundation forums, and many people are excited about it. There is
>>>> absolutely no reason why we need to reject potential friends.
>>>>
>>>> I will consider writing an article myself over the next few days or
>>>> weeks, unless someone else wishes to take this responsibility.
>>>>
>>>> On 11/01/2013 10:37 AM, Jason King wrote:
>>>> > To The Crew,
>>>> >
>>>> > I don't get near enough time to add to the conversation here. That's
>>>> too bad, I am so in awe of the work that is being done here and would love
>>>> to contribute more.
>>>> > I first want to congratulate everyone on the indiegogo campaign. The
>>>> initial showing for the fundraiser is quite impressive. I have no doubt you
>>>> will exceed your financial goals on this. I donated.
>>>> >
>>>> > But I can't help but feel you are sacrificing a much larger
>>>> community impact by not having a more plain words description of the
>>>> benefits of dark wallet. The video is beautiful, well constructed, and
>>>> moving. It does exactly what it was intended to do. I was moved, I agree
>>>> with it's message...I am also /already on this mailing list. /
>>>> > /
>>>> > /
>>>> > The indiegogo campaign has 133 contributors, that is not a battalion,
>>>> much less an army. And my feeling is that if the contributor list was
>>>> public I would already be familiar with most of the names on the list.
>>>> People that are already, publicly, aligned with the goals stated by this
>>>> campaign. Dark Wallet and the other ideals championed by this group are
>>>> important and necessary to EVERYBODY. Even the people that don't know it
>>>> yet. And the marketing campaign, in it's current form, is not digestible to
>>>> a large part of the community.
>>>> >
>>>> > Maybe that's the plan. Maybe you are trying to weed out certain
>>>> classes. But that, seems at odds with the ideals expressed here.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm not saying to stop what you are doing, at all. I'm saying I think
>>>> there is a great force multiplier to be had by having an additional,
>>>> stripped down version of the message that focuses on just the technical
>>>> benefits of the platform as it is being proposed. The benefits are obvious.
>>>> They do not need political overtone, fear, or anarchist galvanization to
>>>> stand on their own merits.
>>>> >
>>>> > Why wouldn't you want trustless mixing?
>>>> >
>>>> > Why wouldn't you want to have alternative full wallet implementations
>>>> free of qt and bitcoind?
>>>> >
>>>> > Why wouldn't you want a more distributed group of developers working
>>>> on Bitcoin?
>>>> >
>>>> > Isn't the whole point of Bitcoin to do away with single point of
>>>> failure?
>>>> >
>>>> > These ideas are powerful, very powerful. The work you are doing IS
>>>> THE REVOLUTION. The revolution does not need a trumpeter next to it saying,
>>>> YO DAWG THIS IS THE REVOLUTION.
>>>> >
>>>> > I propose, sometime in the next few weeks, before the campaign ends,
>>>> you run a piece entitled "Shedding Light on Dark Wallet" that just explains
>>>> all the benefits that Dark Wallet can offer, in very plain terms. Just a
>>>> clean, well put together, article or video that explains the offering you
>>>> are building. Completely free of any other ancillary benefit or protection
>>>> this technology may offer. I think you will be shocked at how well
>>>> something like that will be received.
>>>> >
>>>> > When you have been breathing smog, oxygen needs no hype man.
>>>> >
>>>> > And you say you need work, not ideas. If you guys are interested in
>>>> putting something like that together, I would be privileged to help create
>>>> it and promote it. And I think it will probably shake a few more talented
>>>> workers out of the woodwork.
>>>> >
>>>> > At the end of the day, do we want...
>>>> >
>>>> > To say fuck the US? Or to build the tools that will protect everyone
>>>> from their grasp?
>>>> >
>>>> > To say fuck the Bitcoin Foundation? Or use them as a speed bump to
>>>> dance with regulators, while we build the infrastructure that makes the
>>>> regulators and the foundation irrelevant?
>>>> >
>>>> > To say this world is fucked? Or do the work that makes it better.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I realize I juxtaposed "you" and "we" a lot here. That's because I
>>>> recognize that I have really done nothing to push this forward so far,
>>>> "you" have. But I feel so close to the ideal here, it's hard to not see
>>>> myself in it. I hope you guys will forgive me grammar indiscretions. I am
>>>> in awe of you all.
>>>> >
>>>> > Thank you so much for what you do.
>>>> >
>>>> > Jason King
>>>> > Sean's Outpost
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Tristan Winters <
>>>> tristan_winters@??? <mailto:tristan_winters@hotmail.com><tristan_winters@???>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > They are referring to this:
>>>> http://www.forbes.com/fdc/welcome_mjx.shtml
>>>> >
>>>> > The foundation did not get 9 million dollars.
>>>> > But as soon as the above company got VC backed, they became a
>>>> “Gold Member” of the foundation.
>>>> > And the foundation got a large number of Bitcoins in that way.
>>>> >
>>>> > Anyway, this has clearly touched a nerve in the community. The
>>>> crowd-funding 24hr response shows that.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On 1 Nov 2013, at 2:25 pm, Amir Taaki <genjix@???
>>>> <mailto:genjix@riseup.net> <genjix@???>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > > this article is head in the clouds laa dee da that does not fit
>>>> the reality.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > first of all bitcoin foundation should not be involved in
>>>> development of
>>>> > > bitcoin if that are interacting with the state. that means not
>>>> paying
>>>> > > salaries to people who exert undue influence over the protocol.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > if they choose to continue to be involved with bitcoin
>>>> development then
>>>> > > they should also support dark wallet, electrum, and hive (which
>>>> are now
>>>> > > combining as one project pooling our efforts).
>>>> > >
>>>> > > if they want to be involved in development, then the role
>>>> should be in
>>>> > > establishing a neutral space (which i have not seen be done and
>>>> have no
>>>> > > confidence will be done). i want to see more stick. I've seen
>>>> some cliquey
>>>> > > and sneaky behaviour coming from bitcoind devs. multiple
>>>> instances of
>>>> > > top-down commands (evoking that power when not neccessary) or
>>>> shutting
>>>> > > down debate over contentious issues.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > twice i contacted the foundation over issues where I was being
>>>> unfairly
>>>> > > placed at a disadvantage as a dev because of office politics
>>>> (being taken
>>>> > > off mailing lists .etc) but they refused to intervene. they are
>>>> paying
>>>> > > salaries of devs. I would have words if someone I was working
>>>> with was
>>>> > > acting like a cunt.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > I told this to elizabeth already, and she's a force for good
>>>> working on
>>>> > > bitcoin with pure motives.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > from a journalist friend of ours. he sent me this yesterday:
>>>> > >
>>>> > >> Just got a call from the bitcoin foundation. They wouldn't go
>>>> on the
>>>> > >> record to comment on the article but just kept telling me "off
>>>> the
>>>> > >> record" that you lot have no credibility and that a much
>>>> better story is
>>>> > >> some venture capitalist yesterday investing $9m in bitcoin...
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >
>>>> > > can't stop laughing. ok, where is this 9 million. what is it
>>>> doing? i
>>>> > > haven't seen any of it yet. they have all the resources,
>>>> leigitimacy and
>>>> > > attention but what have they done. they are lost in the
>>>> politics.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > we have donations from many, not 1 rich fascist. how will this
>>>> 9 million
>>>> > > be used. the money from the community will go far, be
>>>> collectively
>>>> > > managed in a multisig and be used well. we don't waste 9
>>>> million on
>>>> > > lawyers giving to people part of the state apparatus.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > why don't they go on record and back up their words?
>>>> > >
>>>> > > godspeed :) today we finally forced an important issue in
>>>> bitcoin to the
>>>> > > forefront. this is where we will make our stand for freedom and
>>>> our
>>>> > > values. great job cody for his mastermind work here.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >> The video is so fucken crazy. Thank God you’re a force for
>>>> good.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Another time and place you could work for the propaganda
>>>> ministry of some
>>>> > >> Eastern Block country. :)
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Check this out also, it’s a balanced piece doing the rounds:
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >>
>>>> http://techliberation.com/2013/10/31/bitcoin-is-going-mainstream-here-is-why-cypherpunks-shouldnt-worry/
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> On 1 Nov 2013, at 2:01 pm, Cody R Wilson <
>>>> codywilson@??? <mailto:codywilson@utexas.edu><codywilson@???>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >>> I'd like to thank everyone on this list especially for the
>>>> tremendous
>>>> > >>> response the Dark Wallet campaign received yesterday. Within
>>>> 24 hours we
>>>> > >>> received just over 25k USD in combined contributions. Share
>>>> the video if
>>>> > >>> you haven't already. It seems to be popularizing the spirit
>>>> of crypto.
>>>> > >>> There is demand!
>>>> > >>>
>>>> > >>>
>>>> > >>>
>>>> > >>>
>>>> > >>> On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 2:05 PM, Amir Taaki <
>>>> genjix@??? <mailto:genjix@riseup.net> <genjix@???>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi!
>>>>
>>>> We're doing a crowd funding campaign for DarkWallet soon. I'm looking
>>>> for any material (especially from people here) that we can weave into
>>>> a tapestry of our vision and ideals.
>>>>
>>>> How we are thinking, what we are working towards, what interests us, ...
>>>>
>>>> Articles, videos, images, forum posts, ... anything. We want to
>>>> present something to the people
>>>>
>>>> * It's not only about the 'black market' but tools for the people, the
>>>> limitations and the monopoly of money / economy.
>>>> * Tools like DarkWallet are your own financial system, a free financial
>>>> system.
>>>> * It's important to talk about independence and community (organising
>>>> together).
>>>> * Everything from petrol, food, computers, even our health is
>>>> manipulated.
>>>> * Finance is one aspect, but we need to take back control of more
>>>> things.
>>>> * Silk Road: $1.2 billion market, 2 murders, >2 years. DPR is a hero.
>>>> Compare that with something like producing rice and all the people
>>>> that die.
>>>> * More simply:
>>>> ** Bitcoin = amazing scifi. The blockchain is incredible.
>>>> ** No technical limitations. The limitations are human limitations.
>>>> ** We will have all the tools, but we need the community.
>>>> * Bitcoin Foun
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> unSYSTEM mailing list: http://unsystem.net
>>>> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/unsystem
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>
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::
Re: [unSYSTEM] Call for material!
