hi John,

until I left, the -log- here attached.
however the conversation continued, i believe.

also to everyone reading, the story mentioned about the estonian logs that
were transported to Kiasma, Helsinki can be tracked and watched here
http://chnldr.blogspot.com/2012/11/human-forestry-10-x-10-meters-est.html

jerneja

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 12:07 AM, John Hopkins <jhopkins@???>wrote:

> On 2/13/13 13:26, Felipe Fonseca wrote:
>
>> Online from now on, feel free to join.
>>
>
> argh, missed today. I did add it to my regular calendar, though, after
> missing last week also! sorry folks -- is someone going to put the log up?
> -- I was hoping to talk about our call for dialogues which hasn't gotten a
> flood of responses yet...
>
> JH
> --
>
>
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++**++++++++++++++++++++
> Dr. John Hopkins, BSc, MFA, PhD
> Watching the Tao rather than watching the Dow!
> http://neoscenes.net/
> http://tech-no-mad.net/blog/
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++**++++++++++++++++++++
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> Brico mailing list
> Website on http://www.bricolabs.net
> Unsubscribe: http://lists.dyne.org/mailman/**listinfo/brico<http://lists.dyne.org/mailman/listinfo/brico>
>

Status #bricolabsX
[Bricolabs welcomes you | www.bricolabs.net]
[21:32] == jerneja [563a517d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.58.81.125] has joined #bricolabs
[21:32] <tapmak> what about neville brody lead guy of the day?
[21:32] <tapmak> hi Jerneja, Andrew
[21:33] <jerneja> hello
[21:33] <agryfp> moi Tapio!
[21:34] <tapmak> moi Andrew!
[21:34] <tapmak> So we are enjoying coffee and nice cake in Uba around a round table while summer rain drizzles around us in the garden...
[21:34] <agryfp> sounds nice
[21:35] <bronac> here an enormous cat has just starred through the window at me
[21:35] <bronac> stared
[21:35] <olygamy> Tapio - now you are mean ;)
[21:35] <bronac> it's not raining in London
[21:35] <bronac> just hilstones
[21:35] <bronac> hailstones
[21:36] <olygamy> no, but it is cold and for some reason muswell hill is still cover in snow
[21:36] <bronac> yes it's nice. it's the chocolate cake I have a bit of a
[21:36] <olygamy> cover=covered
[21:36] <tapmak> oh dear, Helsinki airport had 76 cm of snow the other day. So a day here with friends on a beach gives a very warm feeling indeed.
[21:36] <jerneja> the only thing out my window now is tons of snow...
[21:37] <bronac> can we have chocolate cake in helsinki. the thing is that 'ache' as in pixelache makes me think of toothache and headache...so i am troubled
[21:37] <olygamy> Tapio - enjoy as much as yuo can on behalf of all of us currently stacked in this hemisphere
[21:38] <bronac> or stomach ache
[21:39] <tapmak> a book of Northern miseries ;)
[21:39] <jerneja> enjoy the fruits&sun, yes!
[21:40] <tapmak> recovering from Rio Carneval here too (I know this must sound awful)
[21:40] <bronac> to be Northern is to be miserable and to be Southern is to have pleasure. There the work is done!
[21:41] <tapmak> maybe binary thinking was invented in climates of + and - xtremes
[21:41] <bronac> i love binary thinking. No I don't.
[21:41] <tapmak> That's bipolar thinking dear
[21:41] <bronac> hahah....well that's better than polar.
[21:42] <tapmak> haha
[21:42] <jerneja> listened to a lecture from a phd student Estonian philosopher and artist who joined us here in Maribor yesterday - he discussed eastern europe vs. western...very interesting discussion on colonial thinking.asked him about talinn and helsinki..and good story to share here
[21:43] <efeefe> ok, let's get to it then?
[21:43] <jerneja> he did a performance, while invited to kiasma museum - the contemporary museum in helsinki...and decided to carry wood logs across the bay
[21:43] <efeefe> jerneja: go on
[21:44] <jerneja> while putting them off in front of the museum they were told, no you cannot bring all of the 40 logs into the museum, the logs might have insects (estonian) insects who might damage the art here
[21:44] <jerneja> so they finally managed to get 18 in there
[21:44] <jerneja> but they were not allowed to leave them in finland
[21:45] <jerneja> they had to carry the logs back to estonian...kind of take your dirty logs back to estonia.
[21:45] <jerneja> here we have an order and rules and you are just the outsider...
[21:45] <efeefe> to be on the safe side, we should limit anything in our exhibition to 18 then
[21:45] <bronac> anything organic is a threat to art galleries
[21:45] <efeefe> 40 never!
[21:46] <tapmak> 40-18 makes absolutely no sense of course... curator's aesthetic (read weird) logic perhaps
[21:46] <bronac> kiasma is a bit of a white space right? Tap.....
[21:47] <tapmak> yes, it is a white cube though with occasional interesting programme, especially their theatre
[21:47] <agryfp> interesting story, thanks jerneja!
[21:47] <tapmak> with a more progressive past than present
[21:47] <tapmak> when did the log happen, according to the log shared?
[21:47] <bronac> haha
[21:48] <bronac> it's a story for a bricoreader perhaps a log of the log
[21:48] <jerneja> yes, i am sure this is not the case for pixelache, still it raises some local discussion i guess due to the illegal east european immigrant workers.not being recognized, thus the logs
[21:48] <tapmak> Nowadays Tallinn and Helsinki are both EU and Schengen, so border guys are really bored
[21:48] <jerneja> and the logs. good one
[21:48] == briandegger [5c28fdf7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.40.253.247] has joined #bricolabs
[21:48] <tapmak> but before they were, according to friends working especially in music, literally anal
[21:48] <efeefe> hey briandegger
[21:49] <bronac> brian will yoou tell your story of being paid by the military in the brico reader/
[21:49] <bronac> ?
[21:49] <briandegger> hei efeefe
[21:49] <briandegger> not military
[21:49] <briandegger> but fbi
[21:49] <bronac> oh yeah even better yes
[21:49] <briandegger> so supposedly federal
[21:50] <briandegger> I can
[21:50] <bronac> great *** we want to keep logs
[21:50] <bronac> to bring warmth in the cold northern winter
[21:50] <briandegger> but there was an evening fundered by darpa
[21:50] <bronac> 'fundered'
[21:50] <bronac> i like that
[21:51] <briandegger> and it is interesting how military funding is invading hackerspaces in the US
[21:51] <tapmak> jerneja: that was a really interesting story and would like to know more if they were actually looking at bugs within the log (single or dual meaning) or just had an excuse to get rid of some decent timber from a white cube
[21:51] <efeefe> I remember jaromil complaining that there were 'hacklabs' all over way before the 'hackerspaces' became fashionable
[21:52] <efeefe> maybe that topic could be dig from brico-archives
[21:52] <bronac> also there was that short trail about the tea party which i also found ominous
[21:52] <efeefe> jerneja: can you do a quick report on the pub/reader ideas so far?
[21:52] <jerneja> i was also interested in that one. art managers in lab suit...would do...
[21:53] <efeefe> bronac: I don't remember that one, what was it?
[21:53] <jerneja> the idea was to create conversations among the members on the bricolab mailing list
[21:54] <bronac> uh huh no one really commented but this guy in the US was saying something about community self organisation and citing tea party emergence as a parallel
[21:54] <agryfp> relating a little to the log transfer across the gulf of finland, one finnish performance artist Eero Yli-Vaakuri once transfered some land between the two places..
[21:54] <agryfp> if you are curious about that story he wrote about it a bit here: http://www.storijapan.net/wordpress/%E2%80%9Cland-values%E2%80%9D-at-sculpture-speaks-retrospective-view/
[21:54] <lalenia> <http://ln-s.net/+czG> (at www.storijapan.net)
[21:55] <jerneja> the idea is to make the reader more like a journal/diary. not so centred around articles...however there is also lots of material on the mailing list to go thru
[21:56] <jerneja> contributions in form of essay though should be more centred perhaps on the thematic of north/south and the topics which came out during the logs..
[21:56] <efeefe> is it this one bronac?
[21:57] <efeefe> "I find that people in the US have finally begun to realize that the system isn't working. The movement that spontaneously emerged to support Ron Paul's presidential campaign has gained tremendous momentum, providing intellectual support to the tea parties and propelling Rand Paul into a Senate seat where he can mount an offensive against the Federal Reserve Bank. Since that election, pressure has been mounting in very public ways against the Fed
[21:57] <efeefe> oops, I may be kicked out because of that one
[21:57] <briandegger> i am interested in mapping gambiarra-like concepts in other languages with Ellen Sluis
[21:57] <briandegger> (as part of the reader)
[21:57] <briandegger> less of difference and more of connection.
[21:58] <tapmak> Nice Brian, I was thinking about Gambiarra the last few days too, after pulling one myself and talking about it.
[21:58] <briandegger> words referein to both the improvisation, the improvisor and the attitude
[21:59] <jerneja> good. can you then add your name here http://piratepad.net/briconversations
[21:59] <lalenia> Title: PiratePad: briconversations (at piratepad.net)
[21:59] <briandegger> deffinitely a connection to north and south.
[21:59] <efeefe> briandegger: Victor Vina has been working with gambiarra/jugaad
[21:59] <bronac> speaking of books and parallels - Soenke kindly sent me a copy of Depletion design, A glossary of Network ecologies - def worth seeing?
[22:01] <jerneja> yes got it too...
[22:01] <bronac> it would also be worth digging out the essay Marcos Bastos wrote about Bricolabs in the Parallelo book.....maybe it could be remixed as conversation....
[22:01] <bronac> maybe Tap you might be meeting him? you could remix the piece into a new dialogue?
[22:02] == brv [~quassel@179.228.18.73] has joined #bricolabs
[22:02] <bronac> or collage
[22:02] <brv> good evening
[22:02] <bronac> night
[22:03] <briandegger> done (added to briconversations
[22:03] <jerneja> http://networkcultures.org/_uploads/tod/TOD%238_DEPLETION_DESIGN.pdf
[22:03] <lalenia> <http://ln-s.net/+czY> (at networkcultures.org)
[22:04] <bronac> thanks!
[22:04] <olygamy> ugh - instructing Ivan how to get to this chat :D
[22:04] == efeefe1 [~efeefe@189.110.65.51] has joined #bricolabs
[22:04] <efeefe1> hm, I was offline for a moment
[22:05] <efeefe1> alo brv
[22:05] == efeefe [~efeefe@189.110.65.51] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
[22:05] <efeefe1> you mentioned some experiment you wanted to do right?
[22:05] <tapmak> bronac: not this trip, but have met Marcos once since Parallelo at arte.mov. Should re-read it though
[22:06] <bronac> it reads well in retrospect if you know what i mean
[22:07] <bronac> Jerneja did you see the Paralelo book? it also included a conversation by email between several people inc Tapio
[22:07] <jerneja> nope, where can i find it?
[22:07] <bronac> quite contentious so was more interesting
[22:07] <bronac> em I think I may be able to send you one so email your address to me yeah?
[22:07] <tapmak> here: http://virtueelplatform.nl/activiteiten/paralelo
[22:07] <lalenia> <http://ln-s.net/+czi> (at virtueelplatform.nl)
[22:07] <bronac> haha
[22:08] <bronac> well maybe you like a book so i will search for one also while they still exist
[22:08] <bronac> on paper
[22:09] <jerneja> ok
[22:09] <tapmak> actually, I don't have one either, can you send 2 copies so Jerneja can maybe bring one up North? :D
[22:09] <bronac> oh really wow what did Virtueel platform do with all of them......ok....let';s have alibrary during the exhibition
[22:11] <jerneja> perhaps could write VP directly,
[22:11] <bronac> yes good idea....
[22:11] <bronac> i think i only have two left..but can check
[22:12] <jerneja> also library during the exhibition sounds nice
[22:12] <agryfp> a library of texts is a good idea!
[22:12] <jerneja> archive. of some sort
[22:12] <bronac> brico log made of wooden shelves...
[22:13] <tapmak> or the archive burnt on microfilm and donated to the Helsinki University library.
[22:13] <tapmak> "retro"spective
[22:13] <bronac> nice
[22:14] <tapmak> Felipe is changing his wifi setup coz though you see his nick here efe is off-line
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[22:15] <bronac> what is the temperature down there?
[22:16] <bronac> brv you still there?
[22:17] <tapmak> a physical interface on logs to logs is a nice idea though. Writing on out-of-use telephone poles would be somewhat poetic.
[22:17] <olygamy> very...:)
[22:17] <tapmak> 28ish post rain, during the day way past 30
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[22:18] <bronac> wood be
[22:18] <brv> yes
[22:18] <efeefe> sorry, just lost some minutes...
[22:19] <tapmak> wood?
[22:20] <efeefe> anyway, about the exhibition - some ideas have been mentioned in previous ircs
[22:20] <efeefe> or the maling list
[22:20] <brv> smoke signals?
[22:21] <efeefe> showing objects with their own documentation, how-tos, etc.
[22:22] <tapmak> just read that 2nd hand telephone poles may not be used by a privat person, only professional companies. Truns out that early poles were treated with quite toxic liquid (using pressure). Same goes for rail road wooden parts underneath steel rails.
[22:22] <efeefe> or maybe bricolabs spinoff projects as oswash or others
[22:22] <bronac> wood be somewhat poetic
[22:23] <bronac> i like the idea of exhibiting speculative ideas and exposing the gap between what we do and what is commercial
[22:23] <bronac> speculative lifestyles
[22:23] <bronac> how might os be shown?
[22:23] <bronac> oswash?
[22:24] <bronac> speculative habitats
[22:24] <bronac> will stuff be sent or does it all work in some kind of boundary space where there are no objects? I am not clear about this
[22:26] <efeefe> bronac: I think it's up to us to decide
[22:26] <tapmak> speculative meets retrospective not only wood be but is more interesting than one approach alone
[22:26] <efeefe> we can send stuff, bring stuff, make stuff in helsinki or not have stuff at all
[22:27] <tapmak> reader + a reading lounge of a particular physical design /interface with additional objects?
[22:27] <efeefe> actually, I am planning to spend some time in refabspace in sheffield before coming to helsinki - we could lasercut things
[22:27] <briandegger> seen owlproject? http://www.owlproject.com/ wooden interfaces....any copsing experts in bricospace?
[22:27] <lalenia> Title: owlproject.com (at www.owlproject.com)
[22:28] <tapmak> reader-> rereader
[22:28] <briandegger> <lalenia> snap
[22:28] <tapmak> also a laser cutter at Aalto Uni fablab
[22:29] <jerneja> also nice if merging the pieces with sounds, integrated recordings. resonance...
[22:30] <bronac> yes sounds good
[22:30] <jerneja> delivered thru mp3.
[22:31] <bronac> and also as was said on the list live links from elsewhere through sound maybe
[22:31] <bronac> make a speculative habitat for brico lives inside the exhibition space - with insects (recorded or not).....
[22:32] <efeefe> olygamy: you still there?
[22:32] <olygamy> question regarding the "space" - what the exhibition space would be?
[22:32] <tapmak> in(ter)sect - a new bricolabs species
[22:32] <efeefe> I thought of live links somewhere during the conference...
[22:32] <bronac> hah
[22:32] <bronac> in(ter)sect
[22:33] <bronac> new sects
[22:33] <efeefe> olygamy: there are some ideas for exh space: http://piratepad.net/bricolachevenues
[22:33] <lalenia> Title: PiratePad: bricolachevenues (at piratepad.net)
[22:33] <olygamy> efeefe (still here) - oh ok - looking at that now
[22:33] <bronac> a living breathing exhibition space
[22:33] <efeefe> (plus pictures: https://picasaweb.google.com/104719536953575628394/BricolabsPixelache and http://www.flickr.com/photos/27126283@N07/sets/72157632568072327/ )
[22:33] <lalenia> <http://ln-s.net/+a47> (at picasaweb.google.com)
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[22:35] <olygamy> can we use few of the proposed spaces or only allowed to choose one?
[22:35] <tapmak> when the ideas of exhibition start to gain shape more, I can go on site and take pictures and measurements
[22:36] <agryfp> speaking of aalto fablab..
[22:36] <efeefe1> it gets down to the budget...
[22:36] <agryfp> there may be opportunity to use it around festival time if that is desired
[22:36] <tapmak> the spaces themselves are not off the budget but constructing things would be
[22:36] <agryfp> and a workshop can be made.. i can ask tomorrow when i am visiting there
[22:36] <tapmak> andrew: thanks, that is good to know. Who there is the contact person?
[22:36] <bronac> great
[22:37] <olygamy> what I am thinking is that perhaps first we shall listen to all bricos - who wants to show what, who would like to show soemthing from the past, perhaps some want to do something site specific....
[22:37] <olygamy> and then decide on the distribution
[22:37] <agryfp> since trashlab.info programme, i have good connections there
[22:38] <agryfp> Anu Määttä is the technician there
[22:38] <olygamy> and perhaps we should create another piratepad - so that everyone can put down theit ideas for what they would like to show and see :)
[22:38] <bronac> ok sounds good......so we don't need to work anymore on it tonight....
[22:40] <briandegger> gotta go, may be back on in 30 minutes, otherwise till later :)
[22:40] <olygamy> but perhasp we shall give it some time line, so that the hard core planning can happen in advance :) - dunno - what do you think guys? I mean there is loads of beautiful ideas floating around :)
[22:40] <jerneja> in april I will be in sicily attending trasformatorio laboratory. i would be able to visit hacklab, part of freaknet hacklab
[22:41] <olygamy> (BTW - poor Ivan is still fighting with his Apple mAc to get here :D )
[22:41] <jerneja> i like the idea of bringing myself a piece from there
[22:41] <efeefe1> olygamy: I don't think listening to ALL bricos is possible, but perhaps we should prepare an open call indeed, similar to the one jerneja and john hopkins have prepared for the reader/pub
[22:41] <jerneja> something to carry
[22:41] <jerneja> what do you think about that
[22:41] <tapmak> a bit like before: people who will be there or participate remotely // things to be sent over physicall / as document /// things to be constructed on site.
[22:41] <olygamy> Felipe - yes :)
[22:42] <olygamy> Tapio - yes :)
[22:42] <efeefe1> bronac: actually, that would make us work a lot more, wouldn't it?
[22:42] <bronac> not sure i understand efe?
[22:42] <brv> hehe
[22:43] <olygamy> http://piratepad.net/bricolabexhibit
[22:43] <lalenia> Title: PiratePad: bricolabexhibit (at piratepad.net)
[22:44] <olygamy> lalenia - did we just create the same doc at the same time :D :D :D?
[22:44] <lalenia> olygamy: Error: "-" is not a valid command.
[22:44] <bronac> actually i think the bricoreader call was a little too tight....it constricts the style of what will be there....maybe the exhibition can be more open at least now....
[22:44] <olygamy> oh
[22:45] <bronac> i guess i think we can create a habitat and within that anything can be shown or made
[22:45] <olygamy> lalenia the question was whether we did just create the same doc at the same time :D :D :D?
[22:45] <lalenia> olygamy: Error: "the" is not a valid command.
[22:45] <efeefe1> olygamy: lalenia is a robot
[22:45] <olygamy> jeezez
[22:46] <bronac> a robot called jeezez
[22:46] <olygamy> :D
[22:46] <efeefe1> lalenia: help
[22:46] <lalenia> efeefe1: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
[22:46] <olygamy> :D :D :D :D :D :D
[22:47] <brv> lalenia:)
[22:47] <tapmak> we need a bot to kick that bot's ass
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[22:48] <efeefe1> lalenia: help
[22:48] == efeefe1 [~efeefe@189.110.65.51] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
[22:48] <lalenia> efeefe1: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
[22:48] <efeefe> lalenia: help list
[22:48] <lalenia> efeefe: (list [--private] [<plugin>]) -- Lists the commands available in the given plugin. If no plugin is given, lists the public plugins available. If --private is given, lists the private plugins.
[22:48] <bronac> laughing - yes this is work indeed
[22:49] <efeefe> so, let's work on the call for the exhibition in the coming days, and try to release it until the weekend?
[22:50] <bronac> not for bots
[22:50] <olygamy> sorry - i cant stop loughing :D :D :D
[22:51] <olygamy> anyway - am filing up the http://piratepad.net/bricolabexhibit - will send it around to the list
[22:51] <olygamy> Efeefe - yes
[22:52] <agryfp> good night all!
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[22:52] <bronac> ok bye me too i think
[22:53] <tapmak> we talked with felipe that might be good to think through some guidelines though that let ideas grow but help to produce things that can be also realized....
[22:53] <olygamy> Good night Bronac - thanks for the email and hope to see you on Tuesday!
[22:53] <efeefe> olygamy: I think before thinking of remote/things/etc. we should try to define the range of themes etc. and tapmak notes we should also make it clear that there are restrictions as to complexity etc.
[22:53] <tapmak> so maybe Kasia we exchange some notes tomorrow on it before post to list?
[22:53] <bronac> see you then i hope and bye everyone, speak soon!!
[22:53] <efeefe> oops, that. sorry. haven't read
[22:53] == bronac [56066cbf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.6.108.191] has left #bricolabs []
[22:53] <olygamy> Felipe - yes yes yes
[22:53] <olygamy> Tapio - yes !
[22:54] <tapmak> too funny. We wrote the same thing at the same time even though sitting around the same physical table here
[22:54] <brv> i could propose a local version of the sstv slit scan thing
[22:55] <efeefe> brv: can you use an audio stream to sstv?
[22:56] <efeefe> one aspect that could be explored is the diversity of local installations
[22:57] == briandegger [5c28fdf7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.40.253.247] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
[22:58] <efeefe> nuvem in mauá, maybe vanessa's place in taganga, etc.
[23:00] == brv [~quassel@179.228.18.73] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
[23:00] <olygamy> ok - so Felipe and Tapio - tomorrow for me is super tricky - but what time would you propose to meet?
[23:01] <olygamy> Perhasp over on skype so Ivan can join us (poor thing failed to get to IRC)
[23:02] <efeefe> what's a good time for you kasia?
[23:02] == ivan_ [bd7a036a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.189.122.3.106] has joined #bricolabs
[23:02] <efeefe> ivan_: conseguiu?
[23:02] == ivan_ has changed nick to Guest67584
[23:02] <efeefe> hehe
[23:03] <jerneja> leaving now to the spirits to keep warm...b well
[23:03] <jerneja> aka plum spirit
[23:04] <Guest67584> opa
[23:05] <Guest67584> good evening
[23:05] <Guest67584> boa noite pessoal