Hi,

    This is my first post to the list.  I've been listening now for over
    a month.  I'm a creative technologist living in Oakland, California.
    I devote a lot of my energy to art and free software.

Efe,

    I couldn't agree with you more.  Recently, I find myself in arguments
    with the 30%. They are often of my same type, 30ish with
    post-graduate degrees. I try my best to understand their line of
    reasoning, but only with mixed success.

    Spoken or unspoken, they often imply two things that represent their
    belief structures.  First, they say that absolute equality is not
    possible - because of our "animal spirits" and relative mistrust of
    one another, jealousy, etc. there will always be a world where some
    have more than others.  Secondly, they all seem to feel that the
    majority of the poor are just lazy. 

    On the first argument, I kind of agree.  Some will always be able to
    do more than others. Jealousy about effort and pay could destroy a
    system.  However, if I propose to them a maximum wage of some sort,
    where there can still be (even large) imbalances of wealth, but not
    to an excessive degree, they reject this flat out.  They seem to
    think that capping the wealth that a person can accrue in any way
    would be detrimental to progress and productivity. 

    I then ask them to consider a world where we make less, work less,
    and stress less.  Couldn't a maximum wage aid such a goal, less work
    for all?  Perhaps less productivity.  The argument digresses from
    here saying it would be too difficult to implement. 

    On the second argument, they seem to believe most people in the world
    are lazy.  The righteous go so far to say "you only have a right to
    critique the billionaires when you yourself have EARNED a billion
    dollars"  I then mention statistics that over 50% of billionaires
    were born into their wealth and that upward class mobility is the
    lowest it has been in the US. 

    These are just two re-occurring themes I've noticed here in the States.
    There are more.  Of course, very few here see the international
    scope.  I try to keep myself informed of the various interrelated
    economic systems, but its really not easy.  I know my arguments are
    also incomplete and inexact, probably even naive.  It's simply too
    big of a problem, and I am only one piece in the puzzle.

    I'd be curious to know what kind of conversations you are having.
    I guess I am personally looking for some more focus than just some
    fuzzy and perhaps abstract discontent with the 1% ... or 30%. 

    -august black.

Felipe Fonseca say:
> I don't care that much about the 1% (as I'm sure I will never
> convince or even reach them). But those, say, 30%, who follow the 1%
> unknowingly, repeat every stupidity they utter and tunr the world
> into prejudice and hatred. These are people I see everyday, live
> with, talk about things of life. And they feel so right it scares
> me.
>
> efe
>
> Em 09-11-2011 18:58, Jaromil escreveu:
> >On Wed, 09 Nov 2011, John Hopkins wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>>Yes you hear me, I'm talking about *conflict*.
> >>
> >>shall I give instruction on the art of being a sniper?
> >
> >not that far John. if I was ever up to open real holes in people's
> >heads then my life would have been way different from what it is now
> >and probably much worst and less effective in changing things, even if
> >I'm horribly good at aiming. Firearms aren't at all effective.
> >
> >I'm talking about a worldwide moment of superficial, basic yet
> >powerful and widespread protest against the so called 1% and I'm
> >talking about the role of cultural mediators.
> >
> >why should we mediate for peace? what is that they call peace? is
> >there a game we are really playing? I don't see it even worth being
> >called a game. as far as I understand that's also why many of us are
> >busy making new playing fields (from currencies from occupied public
> >space). But what I'm asking is about the other side of the coin: why
> >should we coop with this shit and hypocrisy that is thrown at us?
> >
> >have we drawn a line? how far?
> >
> >sniping is lame, that's what diplomats and beaurocrats do already.
> >
> >I prefer a good old punch in the solar plexus.
> >Or a stampede of gnus.
> >
> >ciao
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Brico mailing list
> >Brico@???
> >http://lists.dyne.org/mailman/listinfo/brico
> _______________________________________________
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> Brico@???
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