I mostly agree with Bracham.



I am a longtime Linux Mint Cinnamon Edition user and I would recommend this distro. Linux Mint MATE edition also had some things going for it (especially on older hardware) but I am not sure if they still make that.



For my part I have upgraded or reinstalled all my Mint systems to Devuan with Cinnamon installed and I am very happy with them. But I would caution that this route can have a few pain points, not many but maybe enough to cause problems.



For me, most issues with Devuan + Cinnamon went away when I installed a Hardware Enablement Kernel. This is not needed on older machines so perhaps your wife's Win 10 PC is old enough that it would not be an issue.



However, I still have occasional problems with the RTC. Strangely this does not happen on my notebook anymore since HWE kernel but does happen on my son's N5150 (Atom derivative) mini PC. Symptom is it won't connect to websites and complains of certificate errors. My recommendation for this issue is sudo date --set="xxx" followed by an immediate reboot to write the RTC otherwise its only held in the 8254 timer until you reboot I think. My son does not like to reboot as it logs him out of his game, so perhaps that is why he had the issue more.



I think more pertinently an issue with Devuan vs Mint is you cannot really take advantage of Mint's excellent documentation, community and resources if you are on Devuan. Well, I love this community, but I suspect a forum style would be easier for Sylvia, Steve's wife. And with forums you can easily read old issues and how to fix.



Mint also has a more beautiful interface out of the box. I hardly ever customize the GUI (only the text size -- and I only very lightly customize the command line with a small block that I add to .bashrc containing lines such as "export EDITOR=vi") but luckily I prefer Devuan Cinnamon's plain blue look.



So my recommendation is to go with Mint initially, then after a year or two offer to upgrade it to Devuan. She probably can't do this herself, but with a little command line fu it's a straightforward procedure and you do not have to reformat or lose anything. Once she is comfortable on Mint I don't think Devuan would present any issues.



I also think systemd is less of an issue for a user. I tolerated it for years as a user but switched to Devuan firstly on my servers due to 2 issues

- it wouldn't let my server processss run and would keep killing them, perhaps due to CPU load or some such

- one day systemd-resolved stopped resolving even though a thorough investigation revealed that all other parts of the resolver chain were working perfectly -- then, restarting systemd-resolved with log level set to debug "fixed" the issue... ugh!



Cheers,

Nick








>
> On 16 Apr 2026 at 6:31 am, dng-request <dng-request@???> wrote:
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. bluetooth systemd dependencies (Peter Duffy)
> 2. Help for my wife (Steve Litt)
> 3. Re: Help for my wife (Bracham Holfeld)
> 4. Re: Help for my wife (Mario Marietto)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2026 16:10:08 +0100
> From: Peter Duffy <peter@???>
> To: DNG <dng@???>
> Subject: [DNG] bluetooth systemd dependencies
> Message-ID:
> <4e381c83f63859931805e6114eb7f2b7310e7f1e.camel@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> In my main daedalus machine, I'm currently trying to investigate an
> obscure bluetooth problem: old device which pairs fine, but bluetooth
> won't connect to it (it does actually seem to connect, but then
> disconnects immediately with the message "Failed to connect:
> org.bluez.Error.NotAvailable br-connection-profile-unavailable". The
> output from "bluetoothctl show" on the device includes the "Serial
> Port" UUID, and that doesn't seem to be available on the
> server/adapter. So that's the current working hunch. At the moment, I'm
> struggling to understand how bluetooth works - I probably need to get
> books and go back to basics. (Queries on search engines for the error
> message just produce endless "have you tried . . . ?" hits, without any
> definite information as to what the message means.)
>
> Using the available debug settings on bluetoothd haven't helped so far
> (well, I now know which bit of code is generating the error), so I'm
> now turning to the source. I installed the source using "apt-get source
> bluetooth" and I'm now trying to do a local build (once I can do that,
> I'll be able to insert some extra debugging statements and hopefully
> start making some progress). At the moment, I'm hitting problems with
> systemd dependencies. ?
>
> I ran "apt-get build-dep bluez" - it failed with "builddeps:bluez :
> Depends: systemd but it is not installable".
>
> In the source directory, I ran "./bootstrap" and that succeeded. I then
> ran "./configure" - it threw up some dependencies which I was able to
> fix by installing specific packages. It's now stuck on "checking
> systemd system unit dir... configure: error: systemd system unit
> directory is required".
>
> Thoughts would be welcomed. Just to be clear - at this point, I'm not
> looking for help with the bluetooth issue itself, just with the source
> code build problem. Apologies if I'm missing something obvious, or if I
> should have done more research before installing the source package.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2026 16:19:47 -0400
> From: Steve Litt <slitt@???>
> To: DNG <dng@???>
> Subject: [DNG] Help for my wife
> Message-ID: <20260415161947.000a36a8@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> Hi all,
>
> I need your help very badly.
>
> My wife (Sylvia Litt) has been a faithful Windows user since 1995, but
> now she's starting to get pissed off at Win11's complexity and cloud
> bullshit. So, after years of rebuffing my offers to give her a Linux
> computer, a few days ago she came to me asking if I could put Linux on
> her ancient Win10 computer: A very capable computer that's been brought
> to its knees by Windows 10 and bloatware. I agreed to do it.
>
> Now here's the thing. Sylvia's skillsets are completely different from
> mine. She lacks the ability to translate a computer's output into
> suggestions for what she should do next. She needs a very easy and
> straightforward system. Also, she can't fix or work around minor
> problems, so each problem requires my time, and I don't want to do
> minor IT chores daily. Although I use Void Linux, Void Linux would be
> the kiss of death for Sylvia. It's just too close to the metal and DIY.
>
> The traditional suggestion for people like Sylvia would be Ubuntu or
> Mint. Ubuntu's new sandbox jail packaging system, whatever it's called,
> is something I find deeply discouraging, but my understanding is that
> Mint uses the old APT packaging system. For Sylvia's computer, as
> opposed to mine, systemd is NOT a showstopper, because her computer is
> much more of an appliance and much less of a toolkit than my computer.
>
> That being said, avoiding systemd on Sylvia's computer would be nice,
> ESPECIALLY if it could use runit instead of that awful (but not as bad
> as systemd) sysvinit. So I'm thinking maybe I could lay down a Devuan
> system with an ultra-easy workflow, perhaps LXDE, LXQt, or if you guys
> think that XFCE has cured its old intermittent problems from 15 years
> ago, XFCE.
>
> I'd anticipate that her main applications would be browsers and
> LibreOffice, because her email is kept on Gmail (hey, don't shoot me,
> I'm just the messenger).
>
> I would probably install using a thumb drive.
>
> Another difference between Sylvia and myself: Sylvia cares about
> aesthetics. A nice wallpaper, ideally something designed by golinux,
> would go a long way toward her acceptance of Linux.
>
> Given all this, what would be my best route forward using Devuan?
>
> Thanks,
>
> SteveT
>
> Steve Litt
> http://444domains.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2026 14:28:39 -0600
> From: Bracham Holfeld <bracham@???>
> To: DNG <dng@???>
> Subject: Re: [DNG] Help for my wife
> Message-ID: <ee829c6a-05fb-4cf0-a7cb-dcbbb261ba4f@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hey Steve,
>
> I've set up mostly all with Devuan now. For the computer illiterate, I use Devuan with the Cinnamon DE, make some slight adjustments, and it handles fairly similarly to Windows.
>
> The one computer I set up recently with Debian "for stability sake" I'm likely going to convert to Devuan.
>
> I can give more details if you'd like but that's the basics.
>
> Just my two cents worth.
>
> Bracham
>
> Apr 15, 2026 2:20:25?p.m. Steve Litt <slitt@???>:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I need your help very badly.
> >
> > My wife (Sylvia Litt) has been a faithful Windows user since 1995, but
> > now she's starting to get pissed off at Win11's complexity and cloud
> > bullshit. So, after years of rebuffing my offers to give her a Linux
> > computer, a few days ago she came to me asking if I could put Linux on
> > her ancient Win10 computer: A very capable computer that's been brought
> > to its knees by Windows 10 and bloatware. I agreed to do it.
> >
> > Now here's the thing. Sylvia's skillsets are completely different from
> > mine. She lacks the ability to translate a computer's output into
> > suggestions for what she should do next. She needs a very easy and
> > straightforward system. Also, she can't fix or work around minor
> > problems, so each problem requires my time, and I don't want to do
> > minor IT chores daily. Although I use Void Linux, Void Linux would be
> > the kiss of death for Sylvia. It's just too close to the metal and DIY.
> >
> > The traditional suggestion for people like Sylvia would be Ubuntu or
> > Mint. Ubuntu's new sandbox jail packaging system, whatever it's called,
> > is something I find deeply discouraging, but my understanding is that
> > Mint uses the old APT packaging system. For Sylvia's computer, as
> > opposed to mine, systemd is NOT a showstopper, because her computer is
> > much more of an appliance and much less of a toolkit than my computer.
> >
> > That being said, avoiding systemd on Sylvia's computer would be nice,
> > ESPECIALLY if it could use runit instead of that awful (but not as bad
> > as systemd) sysvinit. So I'm thinking maybe I could lay down a Devuan
> > system with an ultra-easy workflow, perhaps LXDE, LXQt, or if you guys
> > think that XFCE has cured its old intermittent problems from 15 years
> > ago, XFCE.
> >
> > I'd anticipate that her main applications would be browsers and
> > LibreOffice, because her email is kept on Gmail (hey, don't shoot me,
> > I'm just the messenger).
> >
> > I would probably install using a thumb drive.
> >
> > Another difference between Sylvia and myself: Sylvia cares about
> > aesthetics. A nice wallpaper, ideally something designed by golinux,
> > would go a long way toward her acceptance of Linux.
> >
> > Given all this, what would be my best route forward using Devuan?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > SteveT
> >
> > Steve Litt
> > http://444domains.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Dng mailing list
> > Dng@???
> > Manage your subscription: https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
> > Archive: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/list/dng.en.html
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2026 22:30:04 +0200
> From: Mario Marietto <marietto2008@???>
> To: Steve Litt <slitt@???>
> Cc: DNG <dng@???>
> Subject: Re: [DNG] Help for my wife
> Message-ID:
> <CA+1FSijMqJFCdOx1y4+PFOOTBDdgoLYYEF_MDRd0bDN8byxnWg@???>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hello Steve,
>
> My humble opinion is that she needs a 24 / 7 teacher that can help her. You
> can't be. But I think Claude can. I'm sure Claude has the patience to
> explain to her a lot of stuff. So the problem of which Linux distro chooses
> will become secondary.
>
> Mario.
>
> On Wed, Apr 15, 2026 at 10:20?PM Steve Litt <slitt@???>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I need your help very badly.
> >
> > My wife (Sylvia Litt) has been a faithful Windows user since 1995, but
> > now she's starting to get pissed off at Win11's complexity and cloud
> > bullshit. So, after years of rebuffing my offers to give her a Linux
> > computer, a few days ago she came to me asking if I could put Linux on
> > her ancient Win10 computer: A very capable computer that's been brought
> > to its knees by Windows 10 and bloatware. I agreed to do it.
> >
> > Now here's the thing. Sylvia's skillsets are completely different from
> > mine. She lacks the ability to translate a computer's output into
> > suggestions for what she should do next. She needs a very easy and
> > straightforward system. Also, she can't fix or work around minor
> > problems, so each problem requires my time, and I don't want to do
> > minor IT chores daily. Although I use Void Linux, Void Linux would be
> > the kiss of death for Sylvia. It's just too close to the metal and DIY.
> >
> > The traditional suggestion for people like Sylvia would be Ubuntu or
> > Mint. Ubuntu's new sandbox jail packaging system, whatever it's called,
> > is something I find deeply discouraging, but my understanding is that
> > Mint uses the old APT packaging system. For Sylvia's computer, as
> > opposed to mine, systemd is NOT a showstopper, because her computer is
> > much more of an appliance and much less of a toolkit than my computer.
> >
> > That being said, avoiding systemd on Sylvia's computer would be nice,
> > ESPECIALLY if it could use runit instead of that awful (but not as bad
> > as systemd) sysvinit. So I'm thinking maybe I could lay down a Devuan
> > system with an ultra-easy workflow, perhaps LXDE, LXQt, or if you guys
> > think that XFCE has cured its old intermittent problems from 15 years
> > ago, XFCE.
> >
> > I'd anticipate that her main applications would be browsers and
> > LibreOffice, because her email is kept on Gmail (hey, don't shoot me,
> > I'm just the messenger).
> >
> > I would probably install using a thumb drive.
> >
> > Another difference between Sylvia and myself: Sylvia cares about
> > aesthetics. A nice wallpaper, ideally something designed by golinux,
> > would go a long way toward her acceptance of Linux.
> >
> > Given all this, what would be my best route forward using Devuan?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > SteveT
> >
> > Steve Litt
> > http://444domains.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Dng mailing list
> > Dng@???
> > Manage your subscription:
> > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
> > Archive: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/list/dng.en.html
> >
>
>
> --
> Mario.
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